26X trailer swap

[hart]

Hey all. Long time no see. My baby has sat neglected too long due to life circumstances. Time to bring her back to her former glory.

First up, a trailer swap. My X is a 2001 sitting on the original trailer. Both wheels/hubs have failed and are no longer attached. And the axle may be broken. Not sure.



A few years ago I bought a Venture trailer for her but couldn’t afford to do anything with it after that. The past couple of days I’ve reset it to hopefully fit the Mac:



I used measurements from the original trailer as well as info found searching this forum to set the trailer up. The bow roller/winch is the same height as the original factory trailer. Length from trailer bowroller to the stern end of the bunks is 22.5 feet.

Eventually I’ll add guide ons of some sort on the sides for loading. And some sort of support to rest the swing keel on.

The bunks are not at their final heights or widths yet. Setting that as close as I can to fit the boat today. Just waiting on the dew to dry before I go crawling on the ground.

Couple of questions for you gurus: First, there are only 2 cross members supporting the new long bunks. I’ve seen similar setups with two but also three. Three seems safer. Do you think I need the third? If so, do you think it would be ok with two just sitting in the yard for a couple months? I’m already over budget on the trailer project but I need to get the trailers swapped to get the HOA off my back.

Second, The big part of this project is getting the boat moved over. Current plan is to jack the boat up using a mix of two 4x10 beams and 4x4’s as needed and maybe support the stern with a couple stacks of old tires for insurance. Then cut the old trailer out section by section, sliding the new trailer in as we go. Sound feasible? Any advice or do’s or don’t’s?

I’ll post updates if anyone is interested. And I appreciate any and all advice.

[hart]

Next thought: The boat sits about here over the old single axle:



I’ve set it up so the same spot on the boat sits centered in between the two axles on the new trailer. But now I’m wondering if I shouldn’t shift it forward a little? Not sure and would love thoughts.



Basically the dirty smudge on the boat will be over the rusty bolt on the new trailer fender. Gotta love my reference marks right?

[Jimmyt]

Nice looking trailer!

If the old trailer will roll, you can get the boat off without cutting the trailer up.

Drop the tongue as low as you can (which raises the stern). Support the stern at the high elevation. Now, raise the tongue as high as you can and support the bow. Drop the tongue some and roll the trailer forward. You'll have to use a floor jack, or additional trailer tongue lifts to "step" over the axle and cross braces unless you build a bow Support that can span the trailer. If your 4x10s are long enough, you have it made in the shade!

As far as placement on the new trailer is concerned, you want about 300 lbs of tongue weight. So, put it on where you think it will give you that, check it, and adjust as necessary.

Always interested to see what others are doing. Please post pics.

[hart]

Sadly the old trailer isn’t rolling anywhere:



Both sides look like that. I have a thought about knocking together a “sled” out of 2x4’s and plywood to drag the old trailer out with though as opposed to cutting it up.

Oh, the beams are long enough. They are the original longitudinal bunks off the new trailer:



300 lbs of tongue weight. Got it added to my notes. Thank you for that!

[Tomfoolery]

That's an equalized leaf spring suspension, so as far as the C of G and tongue weight goes, it acts just like a single-axle trailer. Even if it's bow high or low, though you should still set up the hitch to hold the trailer rails level.

As to how much tongue weight, I've found that mine is too light and I have to store travel stuff forward to get the tongue weight up. Mine weighs more than 4000 lb even though it's an original steel trailer (but retrofitted with two axles). I've never weighed it, so it could be as much as 4500 lb. That means it needs at least 400-450 lb tongue weight.

So if yours is light in the nose, now is certainly the time to correct that by moving the boat forward.

Below is a graphic I made at some point long ago showing the mathematical relationship between the boat CG and the tongue weight. I believe these dimensions are based on my original equipment trailer and the 26X CG location. The boat is probably too heavy at 4000 lb (or not, if packed for travel), but you can fill in your own numbers to see what the boat contributes to tongue weight. The trailer weight is not included, and is simply added to the tongue weight caused by the boat.

As drawn, and at 4000 lb for the boat, moving the boat forward 6" adds about 100 lb to the tongue.



Just remembered I had this. Pasted an actual photo of my boat into AutoCAD and added force vectors and constraints and such to illustrate what's going on. Hopefully you can read it all, but if not, I can break into two separate photos and post them larger.

The CG of the boat was determined by calculating the difference in tongue weight of the empty trailer and the loaded trailer and knowing approximately what the boat weighs.

[hart]

Tom, thank you so much. The boat towed beautifully on the OEM trailer, but it’s been so long since I’ve moved it I don’t recall my tongue weight. Used to know that all that stuff by heart.

I’ll dig in to the graph. Really appreciate the info.

[Jimmyt]

Yikes! I see why you're swapping it out. The good news is, your beams can be used to hold the boat while you drag the trailer out. I would build some temporary bunks that approximat the stern and bow shapes on top of the beams you have. Make sure to make the supports tall enough to drive the new trailer under Block them up with a wide base and secure everything so your support beams can't roll over or topple. Shouldn't be too bad other than lifting it onto the beams from the old trailer. If the trailer frame is still structural, I'd probably try to place a fulcrum support near the axle location and use the trailer to lift it. If not, you'll have to jack it onto your temporary supports (unless you own or build a gantry).

[Russ]

That old trailer looks scary. The new one looks really nice.
I'm no mechanical engineer, but your new trailer looks a lot stronger than the stock aluminum M trailer.


When I added a second axle, I moved the current axle forward (16" I think) and the new one back so the boat would be centered on the old single axle location. I've never tested the tongue weight, but my boat is aft heavy (big motor and 2 12gal tanks) so in retrospect I wish I tested to see if it needed more tongue weight and moved the boat forward.


Here are a few threads that might help

http://www.macgregorsailors.com/forum/v ... =8&t=16853

http://www.macgregorsailors.com/forum/v ... 11&t=24879

http://macgregorsailors.com/forum/viewt ... =8&t=15753

[hart]

If the trailer frame is still structural, I'd probably try to place a fulcrum support near the axle location and use the trailer to lift it.

I had that thought too. I’m not sure yet whether I trust the old trailer that much though.

That’s a good idea about the temp bunks on the beams. I like it.


Russ! Good to see some of the names I remember from back when I was active before. Thanks for those links. I’m sure they will help

[hart]

The neighbors are all astir. “He’s messing with that boat!” That’s been sitting for years. They should be ecstatic.

I’ve done all I can to the trailer for now. Prepping the boat for lifting by removing as much weight as I can. Apparently I have a leak. There was a fair amount of water in the boat. Using the shopvac to clean her out and lighten her up.



Sadly it looks like mice got in it at some point. Shredded the main sail. Not sure about the jib yet. Not a major loss, they need replacing anyway.

Off topic: I want to hose her off so bad for the pictures. But soaking the ground seems like a bad idea right now. Plus who wants to be rolling around on wet muddy ground? Not me.

I think I can use the old trailer to “see saw” the boat up. Beat on the frame in 8 million spots with a hammer and it seems ok.

[yukonbob]

It might be worth the phone call to a local crane company. Could be a couple hundred bucks and have it sitting safely on the new trailer in less than an hour. Worth looking into IMO.

[Jimmyt]

Glad you found out about the water BEFORE you tried to move it

[hart]

It might be worth the phone call to a local crane company. Could be a couple hundred bucks and have it sitting safely on the new trailer in less than an hour. Worth looking into IMO.

Did that a few months ago. $1800. And I’d have to sign A waiver saying they weren’t responsible if they dropped it or if their crane cracked my driveway. No thank you.

Not trailer related but the steering still works! I thought for sure the cable would be seized. Little things like that make me happy. I’ll have to do a log in the repair/modification section to keep up with all the stuff I’m finding.

[yukonbob]

Ouch! That’s an outrageous price! No wonder you’re going this route. Good luck and be safe.

[Russ]

For that price, you could buy your own lift

http://www.gohoist.com/buy-now.html