M Steering Dramas

[Dan B]

I agree with Bill - the comparison of manual to power steering is a good one. I always sail with the motor up and connected to steering, with the key in. I drop the motor (and even start it and in neutral) if there is any chance of needing it. I wouldn't want to have to fiddle with re-connecting it in an emergency.

I would certainly love to have a lighter touch steering. The bigger boats I have chartered require very little effort to steer. My Mac steers like my brother's old manual steering AMC Gremlin in comparison. I guess it is the weight of turning a 400 lb. motor with the rudders.

The option of locking it centered, but disconnected from the steering sounds very appealing. However, will I lose what little steerage I have in low speed by steering with just the rudders?

[richandlori]

Dan,
From my experience you wont loose significant control by having the motor removed from the linkage and locked in the center position. In fact, I operate my boat this way all the time. It makes the boat behave much more like a "true" sailboat with a fixed prop and only rudders for turning. Quite often (did it all of last weekend), I fixed the motor in the center position and then motored out of the harbor. I sailed all around (from Oxnard to Ventura Harbor) with the motor locked in the centerline position. All you need to do is simply raise and lower the engine when you need it! I would recommend giving it a try when you have plenty of room.

I dock in this confuguration all the time, but I DON't put the boat on the trailer this way......just to be safe.

Rich

[Sloop John B]

It depends on where you are and the circumstances.

Merc Big Foots and Yamaha high thrusts with the 14" prop, lock your motor straight ahead on that back stud, then turn your rudder hard and watch where it goes. Guys with dinky props might want to check this out also.

Recommend you do this on the beach, and don't have the prop spinning.

I hate to let go the wheel on a heel and have the wheel spin wildly as the motor drops (whether its down or tilted up). I also get into situations where I need the motor fast to keep from getting killed.

Making the adjustment back and forth in a rough sea would cause me to lose my glasses, have the huge ring ding or cotter pin go overboard, make me nauseous and heave, and then get tossed off the back.

[Frank C]

This debate (the outboard's impact upon steering under sail) is absolutely futile. We even have two different Mac dealers here in diametric disagreement.

Still unsure how this thread migrated from wheel size" to "steering under sail."

In my own case, I agree w/ Bill's suggestion to leave the motor connected, and I would usually opt to have it lifted just clear of the surface. That works perfectly for me, since my Suzi 60/70 DOES NOT FLOP when the boat heels - even when heeled 35 deg. in SF Bay. However, after having read numerous owner reports where their motors DO FLOP to the side upon heeling under sail, one might only guess that such behavior varies with the individual motor installation. So it's futle to make any generalized recommendation.

Regarding "the emergency need" to have motor fully at-the-ready when sailing, this is clearly dependent upon one's sailing proficiency, the proximity of danger (other boats, concrete weirs, rocks, etc, plus the severity of winds and current.
Again ... it is futile to generalize.

[richandlori]

Frank,

I think (hope) that the readers here know that when most people are contributing their ideas/thoughts to a particular post, that they are doing so based upon their own boat and circumstances. So all different types of: boats, motors, helm configurations, sailing "philosophies", skill and experience levels, and karma post their thoughts and then the readers can pick through what they like and don't like. If we couldn't make posts that "generalize" then there would sure be a lot less posts and diversity of opinion and even though it would give us less time to read the "posts since last visit" is wouldn't be as informative.

Rich

[Dimitri-2000X-Tampa]

With a sportpilot attached, it adds enough friction to keep the motor from flopping. Interestingly, when I first got my boat, the autopilot was broken so I sent it in and used the boat without a/p for 3 weeks. During the first couple weeks, the motor didn't flop at all, but then I shot some grease into the steering tube, and that extra little bit of lubrication made it start flopping under heel. After I reconnected the A/P though, everything went back to normal.

[richandlori]

That AP fact is interesting, because I plan on adding an SP+ at some point in the future.

Thanks

[Tom Spohn]

We found that the Tohatsu 50 on our X could be connected all the time, but the heavier 70 Suzuki on our M needed to be disconnected when sailing.

Also keep in mind that if the engine is disconnected and conditions warrant a touch of "iron genny" and you lower the engine the rudders will steer the boat just fine with the engine locked in the center position, at least up to hull speed. Most of the small keel boats around here have the 8hp motor locked in center and depend on the rudder. If you are worried that you won't be able to turn when the motor is locked in center and the rudders are down--try it in a safe place first. You will be surprised

[Jim Cate]

We have the Tohatsu 50 on our 26M, and although the motor doesn't flop from side to side, I have not been satisfied with the "feel" of the steering system. - When turning the steering wheel moves both the motor as well as the two rudders, the drag and friction on the wheel tends to block the feedback normally felt from the wheel. - Thus, the resistance makes it harder to sense when and how much to turn the wheel, particularly when tacking. However, I recently installed the BWY Mac steering linkage and find that the steering "feel" is much improved. As has been discussed, the BWY steering linkage permits connecting and disconnecting the motor conveniently with no tools, making it practical to switch the steering as desired when underway. With the motor disconnected, turning the wheel moves the rudders but not the motor, and the boat now has more of the "feel" of a true sailboat, in my opinion.

Jim

[Tom Spohn]

Here is the experience we had with our X and 50 HP Nissan, and our M with 70 HP Suzuki.
1. The X with 50 hp Nissan/Tohatsu would sail and motor fine without disconnecting and reconnecting. True the helm was a tad heavier when sailing than it needed to be, but it was never a problem nor affected our steering.
2. When we first got our M we were sailing across a bay and tried to come about as we approched the other shore. My Admiral was at the helm and she could not turn the wheel. Wind was light and we had a touch of lee helm. Confident that she was just whimping out, I gave the headsail a touch of furl and grabbed the wheel. It wouldn't move for me either, or at least there was enough resistance that I thought I would break something if I persisted--this is a Mac afterall . In this case we lowered the motor and powered through the tack. Fortunately nobody on shore was watching. Later I complained to BWY and they asked if I had disconnected the steering. I had not and when on our next outing I did disconnect the steering it was two-finger easy to turn the wheel with excellent control of the boat. Hence forth we always sailed disconnected and with the engine raised.
3. I don't understand the concern that the engine might not be available for quick deployment if disconnected and raised. If you are sailing along and notice that freighter making 18 knots just behind you, all you have to do is lower the motor, fire it up and steer using the rudders and dagger board which are already deployed to steer out of harms way. If there is a concern that the boat won't steer quickly or sharply enough using just the rudders and dagger-board, just give it a test--you will be surprised at how much control you have with just the rudders--afterall they work fine for sailing--why not motoring?
4. We did discover that leaving the 70hp connected and lowered worked OK when sailing without much heel. Maybe this is what Bill was referring to. Even then it feels so much better to disconnect and raise that we always do so.

[richandlori]

true tom...good post.

I wish I had the 70HP!!!

[JJ]

Has anybody tried the hydraulic steering systems? Looks like Teleflex provides this as well. This would make for a very smooth, low-effort steering system. It has my interest!!

JJ

[delevi]

I love the feel of the helm with the engine disconnected. BWY steering linkage takes just 5 seconds to disconnect or reconnect and the engine is centered and will not flop while disconnected... part of the system's design. An excellent mod for something like $60. There is no added danger since you can power up just as quickly as you tilt your engine down. It stays locked at center and the rudders provide ample steering. If you sail with engine down, it really doesn't matter I suppose. I believe the engine does act somewhat like a 3rd rudder, though much extra drag. Having the engine down and connect would be beneficial in quartering seas. Of course, just my opinion. As for the larger wheel, I would love to get a 46" My 18" is ok but I'm not sure I want to crowd the cockpit with a larger one. Haven't ruled out a 22 however.

[Dimitri-2000X-Tampa]

I'm curious why some of these old threads are locked and some are not?