Looking for a sailboat

[FingerLakesBtr]

Thanks for all of the advice and ideas. I guess what I should have said is I have never been the "captain" of my own boat. My wife and I have been out on friends/relatives boats and have enjoyed the peace and solitude that sailing presents. We really would like to have a boat on Seneca as we are in the process of building a home there, we have deeded access to the lake but are not sure we want to do that (our own mooring) or keep a boat in a marina. There is a marina in Watkins Glen that we most likely would dry store our boat during the off season.

[Divecoz]

Fingers I assure you , you can learn to sail anyMac if you really want to . I did, and my wife has , and it was a lot easier than say, down hill skiing Ah but it does cost a lot more But your building on a lake and what's a house on the lake without a boat . . . . .a boat of some kind? Buy New or buy used,. every model of Mac is out there for sale used ! The 2006 M is the only choice for new. Its all about , wants ,wishes, desire and budget btw .
Lots of arguments for New and for Used so you decide, whats best for you . You will see, if you hang out here long enough, that the used and new owners are both rep'd on this board and even a couple non-owners.
Here is a great Idea Finger's. . . .
Buy your new M from Bill at Boats 4 sail . . .He advertises right here on this board . You'll get a great boat a great price and the extras Bill will do for you ARE almost priceless. Topping lift from Bill is Free BTW and lessons in sailing are free and teaching you how to rig your boat correctly, well THAT IS Priceless . No Ring Dings ever on my boat BTW and never a lost pin or a bolt on my boat .

[argonaut]

Seneca...
I'm with the "not necessarily a Mac" crowd here.
You'll probably sail on Seneca only occasionally venturing other places, making this a wet-slipped boat, you did mention marina/mooring. The season's short there, most folks wrap & block their boats over winter. Also Seneca's -deep-, so shallow water capability is no advantage here.

I'd say you'd like something with solid ballast that is trailerable for the odd long weekend on Ontario or elsewhere.

Catalina 22 - Found everywhere, active owners groups, parts available, cheap, good starter boat. Pop-tops make these good campers.

Oday 22/23 - Similar but centerboard/stub keel hence no metal centerboard to worry with as the Catalina 22 and Mac Venture 17, 21, 22s have. Also cheap. Nice interiors, tough little boats. Pretty quick as sailboats go.

Mac Venture 17,21,22,222. One of the cheapest sailboats ever made, first boat I owned was a 17. The original barebones sailboat. Fine for learning but you don't want to overnight on one unless you're three feet tall. The 22 or 222 is roomier, some have pop-tops. Simple rigging. Active owners. Hardware store parts.

As a bogey an '86 Cat 22 can probably be had with trailer,furler, and amenities for like $5-7K. Sail that for a couple of seasons for good practice without losing your shirt, unless you really want to spend a lot. Any of these small boats and like a 6hp kicker is plenty for a lake.

[Magdaddy]

I just want to throw in my 2cents here. I was in the same boat, so to speak, with little experience, and planned to buy a mac. After actually experiencing the size of one and realizing it was alot to start with, I ended up with a West Wight Potter 19. It is THE boat for learning. Plenty of cabin for 2-3 people, 4 if two are kids. Very stable hard chine design. Been sailed acrossed the pond to Hawaii. Very easy to trailer at about 2500 lbs. (total). Very inexpensive to upgrade/maintain (as boats go). Very stiff and well built boat. Just my experience.

[baldbaby2000]

Here's a Capri on Ebay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Catalina ... dZViewItem

I don't know if there is a swing keel version of the Capri 22 but I've never seen on. This means you can't beach it as easily as a Mac if that matters to you. They are quick little boats. Swing keel boats are generally slower than fixed keel. Also remember that the Mac is rather unique in that it has positive floataion.

[Catigale]

Seneca is deep, but the Cayuga Seneca canal lets you access the jewel that is the NY canal system, and you will want shallow draft for that.

The top 10 miles of Cayuga is also only about 10 feet deep, so that is ideal Mac land.

[RandyMoon]

I learned to sail in my Mac. So it is possible. Exciting, but possible. I would go along with the idea of getting a Mac if you are going to travel around and need trailerability. If you are going to sail one lake, I would seriously think about getting a boat designed more for sailing.

[ALX357]

'Glad to see that the most experienced Mac owners who have "been there and done that" agree that the Macs are their best choice presently, but that for learning all the potential feel of sailing, a small daysailor will be a better teacher.
But I can see the reasons to "cut to the chase" and get the Mac now at any level of experience. If I can indulge myself with this background on my sailing experiences ....

I learned to sail before my teens on Lightning craft and sailing scows, very fast small open sailboats, where there is more forgveness for mistakes, and more instantaneous responsive feedback from the rudder, centerboard, or leeboards, and sails' controls.
Next was a Sunfish/Sailfish or whatever it was, basically a surfboard with a dish you sat in, with a Lateen sail, - a fast little boat made to be turned over and back up on a regular basis.
Then a MacGregor Venture catamaran, and next a Hobie Cat 16 foot catamaran. Very fast and too hectic - too much work tending the sails and staying upright.
8 years in a Hunter 22 regular sailboat, and now the MacX.

[Matt 777]

I am a former newbie to sailing (still am) and bought a new 05 26M last year. I had been out on a sail boat 2x (J24) and was hooked. After much research, I purchased the Mac. I owned the Mac from January 05 to April 05 when I sold it. Someone made me an offer I couldn't refuse. I don't usually post / just enjoy reading the discussion board - but thought I could add some value to the discussion. After launching the boat and sailing it - I quickly learned that you can have you hands full in a hurry in the Mac. The Mac is very tender in gusty weather and I was not experienced enough to feel comfortable in her. We loved the design and interior space of the boat - but it's sailing characteristics made my wife-kids and me a bit nervous everytime we went sailing. We have now settled on the Capri-22 as our next choice. We decided we LOVE sailing and wanted a more traditional sailing hull and a more controllable tiller set up vs. the Mac type dual purpose "power-sailer". My vote for a rookie like myself would be the Capri 22 - Price for these fully set up is around $19,500 without the outboard motor. We were quoted this price that also included the racing package (spinnaker, sheets, pole), canvas package and OB mount. Good luck on your decision!!

[Lovekamp]

My first sailboat was a Catalina 22; I would highly recommend it. A very forgiving boat, pretty easy to sail. It's a keel boat, so you don't have to worry about going for a swim. You can easily spend a weekend on it, or you can use it as a nice daysailer.

All used Catalina 22s seem to be $5000 give or take a thousand. You'll get about what you pay for it back when you sell it. Having said that, you will put some money into while you own it: bottom paint, teak cleaner, etc. It is a pretty low maintenance boat; not as low as a MacGregor, though.

I moved to a MacGregor for the easier trailerability, easier riggability, easier launch, more interior room, and the powering aspect. If you won't need these features, go with an older Catalina 22.

I will also agree with those who promote a smaller boat because, ironically, I am now seeking a small daysailer to own along with my . My older son enjoys sailing, and a small boat that could be rowed away from the launch then sailed around our small local lake would be wonderful both for him and for me!

[baldbaby2000]

I've owned 2 Mac 25's. An easy boat to rig and sail. It has a tiller and a 650lb swing keel so you can beach it pretty easy. I bought mine broken for $1500. After getting the mast straightened and a hole in the hull fixed for $500, and an outboard for $800 we were set. I liked it because it had a pop top so you could stand up in the cabin when it was up. You can also sail with it up. We had an enclosure for the pop top in bad weather which made for a nice big cabin area.

Here's us sailing with a reefed main. Seems like we started winning more races after we got the fully battened main.



Daniel

[They Theirs]

Mac Movies


Pre-“X” Generation MacGregor 26S Full Video…Great entertainment, includes some sailing in heavy conditions

Early MacGregor “X” Full Video…Shows the evolution of Powersailor

San Francisco Sailing short video

San Francisco Sailing Long Version Video

[jda]

They/Theirs,

Thanks for sharing the videos. Got any more?

jda

[Jim Cate]

Thanks for all of the advice and ideas. I guess what I should have said is I have never been the "captain" of my own boat. My wife and I have been out on friends/relatives boats and have enjoyed the peace and solitude that sailing presents. We really would like to have a boat on Seneca as we are in the process of building a home there, we have deeded access to the lake but are not sure we want to do that (our own mooring) or keep a boat in a marina. There is a marina in Watkins Glen that we most likely would dry store our boat during the off season.

Fingers, since you haven't skippered a boat in this size range, if I understand you correctly, I think it would be helpful for you to "get your feet wet" (figuratively speaking of course) before you decide on a particular boat. If you haven't taken the beginning ASA sailing courses, this would be a good way to start, since they give you experience on the water, in boats usually about the size of the Mac, as well as instruction in sailing techniques, safety, rules of the road, etc. Also, you could consider chartering boats of different types and sizes, which would give you a better feel for what you might like. For example, chartered boats are are usually available for afternoon, day, or weekend periods.

I'm thinking that if you are going to invest substantial $$ in a new or newish boat, you don't want to leap in (be sure to wear a PFD if you do) and then find that you don't like it, or would have preferred something else. YMMD

Jim

[mtc]

I would recommend that your choice of boat to learn on would be best determined by the type of learner you are. If you have to learn fast, have things work the first time, get frustrated fast, give up easily - the Mac 26 will make a poor teacher.

On the other hand, if you are a tenacious learner who methodically walks through each procedure, practices, practices, practices, and doesn't freak out when things get hairy - you'll love this little boat.

Just ask any of us!

The Mac 26 is a fine boat, I have one, but as far as a 'learner' of course it would do just fine - providing you have the tenacity and patience to work out all the learning quirks. While the Mac 26 is an excellent boat, it has its limitations - as does everything.

I've sailed many different boats, all with their idiosyncrasies. Some were sluggish, some squirrelly. Some were very easy to get going, some would just resist gaining headway.

Our boats will heel over reeeaaall fast, then hold for a good bit. It's that first 'WWWOOOOAAAAHHH' that usually gets my crew.

If you're new to weather sailing in brisk breezes, the Mac 26 will certainly get your attention. This little boat will fly if set-up correctly, trimmed properly, and helmed with a light hand.


Michael