Lug Nuts

[captin5317]

Snow is melting and the weather here in N Ca. should turn soon. Read the horror stories of trailer wheels passing the tow vehicle. Suggestions on the lbs. of torque for the lug nuts.
Thanks

[Frank C]

Pretty much the standard 90 to 100 ft.lbs. for all cars.

I bought a click-style torque wrench to stay in a gear box in back of the pickup.
It also stows the hitch-receiver & ball, tie-down straps, grease, bottle jack, etc., etc~!

[aya16]

I use a 110 volt impact gun, I started with not being able to break the lugs lose on the motorhome, bought one of those impact guns and wow, off they came, I have used them now for all the lugs on trailers cars trucks. The times I needed it I was near 110 like the generator on the motor home or my portable gen. But some day Ill need it and no house current. so Im thinking a cordless impact or twelve volt. Anyone use the cordless? is it any good. I believe the torque setting on the gun is around 120/200 but when replaceing the lug nuts I sort of do it by feel and my hands are about 90 lbs torque.

[Catigale]

Im trailering instead of slipping this year, so one of my items this weekend is to take all my lugs off, clean them, put a dab of moly grease on the threads, and tighten them to 100 ft lbs with a wrench shorter than the one I carry the car. That last one is sometimes overlooked and can you leave you sitting looking stupid on the highway with any vehicle of course.

My Mac 26 manual calls for 90-95 Ft Lbs torque btw

[Sloop John B]

IIRC Kevin's advice was to torque to 100 dry; torque to 80 if you grease or use no seize. I had to write it down because it doesn't make sense.

[Newell]

If launching in salt I wouldn 't be without using anti-seize. Don't know how much I torque, use a long handle and put the cinch on them.

Second year I owned the boat I broke 3 studs trying to remove the nuts. Anti-seize stopped that.

Newell

[Robert]

I suggest cap lug nuts that cover all lug bolt threads to reduce the rust problem. Here is a web page included so you can see some cap lug nuts. I just did a quick search to locate a picture.
http://www.stocktonwheel.com/lugs.htm

[LOUIS B HOLUB]

Since I experienced the loss of my starboard wheel at 55 MPH, I torque and double check after about 75 miles. I have aluminum wheels, and the metal seems softer than steel rims. And Ive noticed that after 75 miles or so, one or two wheel nuts can be "squeaked" tighter. I use all "cap nuts". My search is ongoing for a dual axle trailer--galvanized or aluminum, with disc brakes.
I personally dont think there is anything to fear if the lug nuts are torqued properly. When I lost my wheel travelling at 55 MPH, the lugs wernt torqued (BIG MISTAKE)! Incidentally, you have to carry an extension for the lug wrench in order to remove lug nuts in case of a flat.
Happy Safe Sailing...

[captin5317]

Thanks folks, I figured it was about the same as a car, but thought I would check anyway. Also replacing the lug nuts with the cap nuts.

[Randy Smith]

My Dad, who was a mechanic for 33 years said, "do not grease aluminum studs and wheels, leave em dry and torque em even". That is his opinion and I can tell you, he has never lost a trailer of any kind...well, there was that axle that fell off....lug nuts stayed on though Randy

[Chip Hindes]

I use anti-seize on my open lug nuts and have never had a problem, though it tends to centrifuge out from the studs and stain the "nice" white wheels.

An impact wrench would be OK for breaking them loose, but a 24" long, 1/2" drive breaker bar with a 3/4" deep impact socket works fine for me, even with my bad shoulder and back. Never tried an electric impact wrench, but I've found my cheapie 1/2" drive air impact wrench which is supposedly good for 240 lb-ft won't do it.

Firing up a generator (which I don't yet have anyway) in order to get a few lug nuts off makes no sense to me, and at something over $200, I won't be buying a cordless impact wrench which also may not do it anytime soon.

[Harrison]

Just got finished dragging my boat 2300+ miles. Torqued all nuts to 100 ft. lbs. Checked them about every 180 miles. with a "click" type torque wrench. Not one was loose.

---Harrison

[Hamin' X]

Old wisdom: Dry. New wisdom: Anti-seize. Never use grease.

On another item, I see a lot of reference to "Dual Axle". Please, the proper term is tandem axle. Duals are side-by-side and tandem is one-in-front-of-the-other. Just a pet peeve of mine, being a trucker and working with horses. No offense intended.

Rich

[Catigale]

Old wisdom: Dry. New wisdom: Anti-seize. Never use grease.

....I guessed that most Anti-Seize compounds are metal in grease, and a quick look at the MSDS for Loctite Anti-Seize shows...

Exclusive formula suspends copper and graphite in a high quality grease.

Oh well.......maybe people used low temp grease which ran all over the place and got into brakes, etc???

[kmclemore]

Well, I don't know where that 'old' and 'new' wisdom comes from, but the mechanics of iron studs and nuts, friction and torque hasn't changed much in the past hundred years or so, so I guess I'm old school. Call me an old fart - I'm over 50 - I've earned it.

Reasoning:

The wheel studs, like any steel bolt, are somewhat elastic - they stretch like rubberbands and they have a memory, up to a point. Depending on hardness and a few other fators, they are specifically designed to stretch a given amount, and no more. Beyond that point they will lose nearly all their return memory and eventually just snap.

Now, the rotational torque on the nut imparts this stretching effect on the stud, and you need that constant 'tugging' back of the stud which pulls down on the nut and keeps it from loosening - that pulling of the stud provides the proper amount of locking friction between the nut and the rim, thus preventing its undoing.

The reason for a torque figure of 90 ft/lbs is to provide the proper stretch without actually pulling the stud past it's 'memory' point. (If you've ever stretched out a spring beyond it's memory point and have been left with a long, sagging and weak spring, you know what I mean).

So... if you add lubricant (grease, anti-sieze, oil, lard, butter, spit, whatever) what happens?

Well, the torque figures are always done with dry studs and nuts since that's a known standard, so if you lubricate the nut and stud you are without question going to be able to impart more turns on the nut to reach that given resistance (the torque reading on the wrench) than you would were it dry.

This means that you will have imparted more stretch on the stud, quite possibly taking it beyond its natural memory point and leaving you with a thinner, weaker and no longer 'springy' stud. And you may even risk snapping a stud when you tighten them.

Without the proper 'spring' of the stud, you've significantly reduced the pull on the nut, and consequently also reduced the amount of locking friction, so the nut is now more likely to come off.

Further, since the lubricant has without question migrated to the friction surface between the nut and the rim, it will take even more tension from that now weakened stud to keep the nut from undoing, since the locking friction will have been greatly reduced by the lubricant.

So....

Don't lube the threads. I know it sounds like the right thing to do. It looks neat and tidy. It's fun. That silvery stuff is soooo tempting to play with, and it makes you feel like you really know what you're doing when you slather on a nice thick glop of that crap.

Don't do it.

Further, I don't know of a single trailer or car manufacturer that recommends it.

Yes, I know many of you may use the stuff and have never, never, ever had a wheel or nut come off. Superb. I'm happy for you. But it's still the wrong thing to do.

There are are situations that are apporpriate to use anti-sieze lubricant - galvanic corrosion, galling, etc. - but this isn't one of them. Besides - in this given instance with the risk and known history of nuts that come off, to a great extent we actually do want the nuts to sieze, don't we? And they call this stuff 'anti-sieze', right? OK.... so...?

If you absolutely feel you MUST use something on the threads, then use Loctite. It will prevent rusting of the threads and also help prevent counter-rotation. Reduce torque figures by 10-15% when tightening with Locktite. And don't use the 'back-off and re-torque' method of checking them in future... just set the wrench for the proper torque and listen for the 'click' when you test'em.