Cheap refrigeration

[Sumner]

....Sumner installed a 12v compressor kit on his big boat. That kind of system could be used to build a built in on the Mac. --Russ

I probably won't ever do it with the Mac but if I was younger and going to keep it for a long time and wanted to do a lot of cruising I'd build something similar...



... to what I did for the Endeavour. The shape of course would have to be modified. The key is the ability to really insulate it. The fridge on the Endeavour is half again as large and probably uses only about 50-60% the elect. as the portable on the Mac.

More here on it...

http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner ... index.html

Sumner

============================
1300 miles to the Bahamas and back -- 2015

The MacGregor 26-S

The Endeavour 37

Trips to Utah, Idaho, Canada, Florida

Mac-Venture Links

[Seapup]

his is a timely conversation for me...at the start of the season I would like to add something better than ice storage.

The budget is a big one. I ain't in the mood to shell out $800 for a real compressorized fridge right now, so I have to decide if a thermoelectric is worth $180 for a season or two.

If I buy the Koolatron I will want it to do the following:
1) When we go on a road trip, keep things cool on the way to a launch site, anywhere from 4 to 7 hours. Cooler will be in the truck with us and power will come from the truck 12V system. Food will be cold when we load it, and we'll dump a load of ice in before we leave.
2) Extend the life of our ice once we get to the destination. I don't expect it to take the place of ice.
3) Keep cold drinks waiting for me at the marina, where we are plugged in to shore power. The boat spends most of its life daysailing out of this marina, and amp draws are not an issue. I have a 100AH house battery and a 100AH starting battery.

Actually, #3 is a big one. I often head down to the boat on the spur of the moment for a quick sail, or use it as a meeting place with friends. I'd like to have a few cold beers waiting for me.

I kind of like the thermoelectric design for the absence of moving parts. Lousy efficiency, yes, but should be durable.

Rather than thermoelectric just get a real compressor 110v dorm fridge, new or used. Less than $100 new at a local store. It will gladly hum along at 34 deg all summer at the marina and stay cold enough for an evening sail just unplugged. Most are about 85w and 50% duty cycle, so with an inverter and some motoring around with the etec charging you can keep it cold all weekend. Bring out the ice for the 3 day and longer trips.

[Ixneigh]

Ok thanks for the people who looked at and clarified the eBay item. Its thermoelectric after all. Do not want!
I ordered a .7 cubic foot dometic brand compressor type cooler from a local RV place. It should be here Friday in time for a ten day visit to the Elliot key area. The price was fairly comparable to Amazon and with faster shipping. I will support local business if they aren't too out of line on prices. I might have bought the .9 cf however the smaller unit closely matched the footprint of my current yeti cooler that sits in the cabin and doubles as a seat. I am used to it being there but any thing larger is out. the price I paid was 379 plus fright and tax.
I will post how it works and weather I'll need to increase my solar wattage.
Ix

[Starscream]

I ordered a .7 cubic foot dometic brand compressor type cooler from a local RV place.

Man, we get the short end of the stick here in Canada.

https://www.amazon.ca/Dometic-CF-018DC- ... frigerator

Add 15% sales tax to that price! but on the other hand I get free medical for life so I should stop whining

This looks like a good option, and a big step up from the Koolatron, but still three times the price. Whatever I end up getting I want it to be able to run on 12V and on 120V, and to fit where the current "icebox" is under the aft dinette seat. And to be transferrable to the truck if I am so inclined.

I spent a lot on the boat over the last couple of weeks so I just don't want to shell out the $700 it would take to get that Dometic delivered to my door. I am still leaning towards the Koolatron because I think it meets my very modest needs and expectations. But the unanimous negative opinions here are giving me pause.

[mrron_tx]

I ordered a .7 cubic foot dometic brand compressor type cooler from a local RV place.

Man, we get the short end of the stick here in Canada.

https://www.amazon.ca/Dometic-CF-018DC- ... frigerator

Add 15% sales tax to that price! but on the other hand I get free medical for life so I should stop whining

This looks like a good option, and a big step up from the Koolatron, but still three times the price. Whatever I end up getting I want it to be able to run on 12V and on 120V, and to fit where the current "icebox" is under the aft dinette seat. And to be transferrable to the truck if I am so inclined.

I spent a lot on the boat over the last couple of weeks so I just don't want to shell out the $700 it would take to get that Dometic delivered to my door. I am still leaning towards the Koolatron because I think it meets my very modest needs and expectations. But the unanimous negative opinions here are giving me pause.

Hmmm I wonder how much trouble a couple of Friends... one from Our side of the border and one from Your side.....say,just happen to be sailing and meet upon the border and raft up ....say for quick coffee and a chat , and One just happen have an extra fridge they don't want any longer , and handed it off Kinda sounds like smuggling eh.

[Russ]

Whatever I end up getting I want it to be able to run on 12V and on 120V, and to fit where the current "icebox" is under the aft dinette seat. And to be transferrable to the truck if I am so inclined.

I haven't plugged ours into AC since un-boxing it. My guess is it has a built in AC-12v converter when plugged into house curren and runs natively on 12v. If you have a battery charger (we do) then the 12v fridge IS running on AC power when the charger is on.

I spent a lot on the boat over the last couple of weeks so I just don't want to shell out the $700 it would take to get that Dometic delivered to my door. I am still leaning towards the Koolatron because I think it meets my very modest needs and expectations. But the unanimous negative opinions here are giving me pause.

The sticker shock is hard to get over. Honestly, I would use ice and a quality cooler before a thermoelectric unit.

--Russ

[Tomfoolery]

The sticker shock is hard to get over. Honestly, I would use ice and a quality cooler before a thermoelectric unit.

That's what I do, sans the quality part. In my case, it would probably be fine to invest in a quality cooler over the el-cheapo that came with the boat. But I don't use it enough to worry much about it. I only refresh the ice once on a typical trip.

Mine also came with a cube fridge under the table, but I took it out and gave it away so I could use the table as a berth. I could probably use another very small one just to keep some water cold at the dock, which is where it lives most of the time (with utility power attached).

But no way I'd spend any real coin on a 12V unit, as I just wouldn't get enough use out of it. Others, from what I'm reading, definitely would.

[March]

I'd like to add my two centavos: the fridge we've been using for more than 13 years is a Waeco 60. It fits perfectly under the aft dinette seat, next to the head. I had to raise the top of the seat by cutting a plywood top and adding a lip of rigid foam around it. The cushion sits nicely on top of it and there's still room enough for legs under the table. Also, I cut some holes in the settee's fiberglass container, for extra ventilation. The fridge worked perfectly for 9 years, on a 2 battery system with a smallish 80W solar panel.

Three years ago, the Waeco broke down. Being unable to have it serviced anywhere in the area (the Danfoss compressor is German) I bought an Edgestar from Amazon for something around 500 bucks (we were on our way to the Bahamas). The fridge was slightly bigger, so we had to keep it under the table. It didn't fit under the dinette seat anymore. It was noisier and more power-hungry than the Waeco, but it did its job all right.Extracting stuff from under the table was very awkward though--the lid wouldn't go all the way up

When I had the opportunity to get a used Waeco on e-bay, I jumped at the chance. Unlike my first model, this one also had a 110 V input which made it even better. I got another broken one which I managed to fix myself (I took the risk, but got lucky. There was nothing major. The keypad was stuck) So now we have to Waecos: one as a permanent addition under the settee, the other one in the towing beast and under the boat's table, but we don't have to lift its lid every day. The Edgestar is relegated to the porch, back at home, and I will probably get rid of it when I get around it; it was used for one season only, and I even have the original box!

The Waeco is still my choice. It's lighter, quieter, and less power-hungry than the edgestar. I'm glad I have two of them in working condition It may be a little smaller on the inside, but it has other advantages. With a three-battery system and 160W of solar power (have added another 80W panel) the two Waecos work just great.

[Starscream]

There seems to be a relationship between Waeco and Dometic.

https://www.amazon.ca/Dometic-CF-035AC1 ... eco+fridge

Still way out of budget for this year.

I don't really mind the cooler/ice thing for trips, but it can be hard to find ice when you suddenly realize that you need it.

I really want cold drinks to be waiting for me at the marina.

I'm slowly talking myself into a Koolatron despite the warnings. That obviously wouldn't work for any real voyaging, but my expectations are low and it satisfies most of my criteria. It's only missing unanimous approval (or, actually, any approval at all) from the members here. Doesn't bode well.

[March]

Starscream wrote:

Still way out of budget for this year

I know what you mean. Since we're talking boatbucks, the first Waeco was $500, brand new, from an obscure dealer in Florida, but it was 13 years ago and had only a 12V input.
The old one I got off e-bay was also $500.
The broken one was $300, shipping included.
I'm just saying that it is possible to get a Waeco for a more reasonable sum. The dealers have realized how good these fridges are and have been jacking their price up with every passing year. 3 years ago it was 700, now it looks like it's over 800.

[Ixneigh]

Hmmm those units are all larger then mine...mine is the cf 18 not the cf 25 or 35. Those were in the five and six hundred range. And too large for the space I have allotted for it. I'm just looking for Cold drinks after a day of exploring on the board or kayak. When I looked at the thermo units at Kay Mart they were the koolatron brand and looked very cheaply made. Not worth 125 dollars. More like a gimmic for tailgating a few times a year. Dometic also makes a thermo unit for a hundred more. Maybe it's of higher quality. The only way a cooler will work for me is if it can chill something from room temp down to 40-50 degrees in an afternoon. Even on Amazon reading the reviews I began to have doubts right away. I'll place cans of juice and small water bottles in it. If it's hot and sunny I'll hopefully have cool drinks. If it's cruddy and cloudy I'm probably not desperate for something cold. So NP...
i also pretty much live on the boat seven months out of the year so anything on there gets a lot of use.
I don't know but some Scotsman probably once said, if it don't work it's no bargain no matter how cheap it was.
Ix

[kadet]

Starscream wrote:

Still way out of budget for this year

I know what you mean. Since we're talking boatbucks, the first Waeco was $500, brand new, from an obscure dealer in Florida, but it was 13 years ago and had only a 12V input.
The old one I got off e-bay was also $500.
The broken one was $300, shipping included.
I'm just saying that it is possible to get a Waeco for a more reasonable sum. The dealers have realized how good these fridges are and have been jacking their price up with every passing year. 3 years ago it was 700, now it looks like it's over 800.

Or get a Faeco like I did There are some pretty good Chinese knockoffs of the Waeco especially as the Danfoss compressor is now made in China anyhow. The CF50 is now made by Sikelan and if you pull the labels of it it looks just like a Danfoss. I had mine for a year and when it is not in the boat it runs 24/7 freezing fish at -18c in the garage, never missed a beat except for the cheapo AC power supply that came with it. Got a decent one of ebay for $50 and never looked back.

[Seapup]

mine is the cf 18 not the cf 25 or 35

It should work great, its the same internals/compressor as the larger ones, just a smaller box so should cool even quicker.

[Ixneigh]

Ok! To my surprise they had it waiting for me this morning. At 11.30 I put some drinks like plastic bottles of juice and glass bottles of water, some cheeses a small package or bacon and a pack of English muffins in it. It's a pretty small space but here what fit without much effort: eight 10 ounce juice bottles, four 12 ounce sparkling water cans, five 12 ounce glass bottles, two six ounce cheeses one regular English muffins, one small package of bacon. I could put in addition, with a bit of care: two more packages of bacon, two more cheeses, one squeeze bottle of mayo and six eggs carefully packed into empty spaces. However I do not refrigerate eggs.
At the time, the bacon and cheese was pre chilled but the drinks where not.
At 1;00 I took out a juice bottle to try. It was pleasently chilled! Not icy cold but nicely cold for drinking...Good.
Now, that's not too bad in my book. I have no clue to power draw. It's very quiet. Just a whisper. It has two vents and they do not blow much air. It's not hot air either. The only part that gets warm to the touch is the front panel where the controls are. Not even as warm as a laptop. Beside the tiny hum of the compressor there is also at times a faint trickling noise.
Some notes from the manual. It can tolerate a 30 degree incline. It is harmed by high voltage. (Malfunctioning charge regulator on a solar array?) and at twelve volts the operating power draw is 7 amps. At 24 v it is three. I'm a bit concerned about that but I know these are supposed to cycle. Also perhaps that's on the high setting. I have it set to low and the temp dial set midway between cold and freeze.
This unit has simple controls. The next size up gets a temp readout, and a push button control panel, the option to run off AC mains. Mine has two led indicator lights and a dial and a switch. That's all. Nothing fancy.
The chest construction is such as an igloo or other consumer brand cooler, and better then the koolatron that I looked at. Not as rugged as the yeti though. I used the yeti as a seat. I would not use this as a seat.
Ix
Oh btw the manual that came with it is for a waeco cool freeze but the unit has a dometic nameplate on it.

[Tomfoolery]

Some notes from the manual. It can tolerate a 30 degree incline. It is harmed by high voltage. (Malfunctioning charge regulator on a solar array?) and at twelve volts the operating power draw is 7 amps. At 24 v it is three. I'm a bit concerned about that but I know these are supposed to cycle. Also perhaps that's on the high setting. I have it set to low and the temp dial set midway between cold and freeze.

I'd be surprised if the compressor has anything but one speed. It will cycle, and the higher the temp setting, the less it will run, but a 2-speed compressor is pretty sophisticated, and usually reserved for larger systems, like A/C.

But I could be wrong.