Ballast valve open or closed during storage on land?

[robbarnes1965]

I've had paper wasps, yellow jackets, and hornets take up residence in my boat.

Hornets were the nastiest...although the yellow jacket nest got to a good 12 inches across...on the bow anchor

Ouch!

[Kittiwake]

I also empty the tank while motoring.

Nervertheless, once on the ramp, I open the valve and about five to ten gallons still pour out of the valve.

Then, at home, keeping the bow tightly secured to the trailer, I put the front jack on a 8 inches wood block and raise the trailer front until the motor gets almost on the ground. It is quite spectacular ! Taking advantage of the slope, I open the head intake valve, thus draining the intake hose so it won't crack open because of water freezing at minus 30 Farenheight, in February.

I then pump out of the ballast tank, one or two remaining gallons of water, using a syphon.

I finally perform the wiping procedure you described, using the coat hanger wire, but, I repeat it until the cloth returns completly dry. Then the tank is positively not wet, the trailer is levelled and put on blocks thus protecting the trailer bearings.

For the fiber to dry I keep both valves open, the aft one only crack open, and I force a draft circulation in the tank. I evacuate the draft out of the boat V berth using a hose tied to the flexible end of a steel funnel covering a 120 volts desk fan secured air tight with a towel.

My boat, like his owner, is «forever young»

As a fellow slightly-obsessive type; I like your logic! And certainly we obsessive, hard working types deserve to live forever.

I find it interesting that, if I understand correctly, you get significant water flow (and later siphoning) from the ballast tank when you tip the bow up as described "until the motor gets almost on the ground". This doesn't happen with my 2010 26M (and I have always done the same tipping thing), and (when I looked with a flashlight this year) the floor of the ballast tank seems quite close to the level of the rear ballast valve .... is your boat the same vintage?

The other thing I find interesting is the possibility you mention of wheel bearing damage through sitting under load all winter. I admit that I considered the same possibility last year .... and tried jacking up the trailer, planning to rest it on blocks. To my slight horror, the frame began flexing; and I realised it was not designed to be a rigid item ... so I quickly let it back down on the tires. I decided that, if I ever wanted to jack it up again, I would have to place the jack under the axel rather than the frame; but my ambition to do so had evaporated - sometimes discretion is the better part of valor. I would be interested to hear whether others have discovered an optimal jack-point.

Kittiwake

[Doupirate]

Mine is the 2002 model, the first M model.

The ball bearing supporting half the load will crunch a little over the winter, a plastic deformation. Over the years, the bearing will have to be changed. The trailer suspension and the tires are also relieved if you put the trailer on blocks. Putting the trailer on blocks results in limiting the actual trailer use (wear) to a couple days a year. (Except for the rust... )

Do not apply jacks on the axel. It is designed for shear loads, not flexion loads. The axel would permanently bend before a wheel leaves the ground.

Put the jacks just BEHIND the wheels, on the main frame, as close to the wheels as you can. Hence you will push close to the center of mass which is located above the axel. The flex effort will be negligible.

Locating the jacks in front of the wheels would cause the trailer front jack to rise. The trailer is balanced so the front jack has very little load on it. Easier for the towing vehicle.

[bscott]

I place my floor jack 1-2" from the spring U bolts on the axle. No bending that I can see.

Bob

[Doupirate]

No flex so close to the end. The U bolts location is where all the loads are tranferred from the frame to the wheels. Good idea, but with a non floor jack, it is more comfortable just behind de wheel IMHO

Where do you locate your blocks?

[captronr]

Kittiwake,

If you are OCD, you might want to refer to an old anti-war book called BrandyWine's War.

One of the characters in that book despised the Vietnam War so much, he went awol and started sending out bogus orders to his former units. One was concerning the rat problem. He ordered that each unit assign an officer to be the Officer In Charge (OIC) of Rat control. His duties were to put a pink ribbon on female rats, and a blue ribbon on male rats, then feed the females birth control pills daily. Eventually (according to him), the rat problem would disappear.

But the order that might apply to you: He ordered an OIC to be in charge of the unit's air in vehicle tires. Everyone knows the humid tropical air is not good for rubber, so the OIC had to establish and carry out a program to remove the air from each vehicles tires monthly and replace with new air.

So there you go.... Swap out the air along with all the other maintenance.

Just trying to help.
Ron

[Catigale]

[Kittiwake]

Good one, Ron.
Being part of this website may prove to be mentally healthy for me: I could start with modest psychological interventions (like refusing to allow myself to refresh the air in my tires) ... and move on to more challenging ones, like leaving the netting off my stern ballast valve ... oooo scary!).
I hope you guys won't bill me for the advice though.
Kittiwake

[RobertB]

Just to chime in on where to jack ---

While getting ready to install my second axle last weekend, I finally figured out that if the boat is on the trailer where it is supposed to be (at or near the bow chock), the hull should not be on the axle cradle/bunk - the hull is supported at the bow and at the aft cradle/bunk. Therefore, jacking/supporting the trailer at the back end of the trailer will not only get the weight off the wheels, it will remove most/all of the loading from the trailer frame. Otherwise, to jack up the frame to change a tire, best done on the frame near the tire (less height to lift).

Current status on new axle - today I tracked down 5/8 by 4 inch stainless steel bolts to attach the trailing arms. Bought extra to replace the ones on the original axle - the galvanized bolts are corroding badly. Just trying to decide if I want to remove the original trailing arms and grease the splines (so they do not permanantly corrode in place).

[seahouse]

Hi All!

From an engineering perspective, the stress applied to a wheel bearing during static loading over the time period and temperatures encountered during overwintering remain well within the range of elastic deformation, and will not enter the range where plastic deformation occurs.

It’s a basic premise that below-yield forces can be applied repeatedly and over time and the steel will continually return to its original shape when the forces are removed. Also, the compressive strength of hardened alloy steel (which applies to the wheel bearing components) is even greater than the tensile strength.

The bearing is designed from the outset to withstand dynamic forces (bumps, potholes) which are orders of magnitude greater than those encountered while the trailer is standing still, and the stress, whether it be on a ball bearing, or roller bearing, is by design not a point load, but distributed over surface line(s)(roller) or arc(s) (ball). (Meaning it’s not the same as Rockwell hardness penetrator).

If surface damage to a race were to occur, it would be much more likely to happen during trailering of the load when the bearing is subject to its maximum stresses, and not while sitting static. (Assuming proper maintenance).

Ironically, it’s the tires that benefit most from being jacked up off the ground and having the load removed from them. I say “ironically” because they are the weak link that is supposed to be elastic (rubber), yet they do undergo (short-term) plastic deformation during storage.

To be sure, (ultra)high-performance automobile tires acquire a flat spot after only a week or two of standing at summer temperatures, which will take several miles of driving to smooth out.

I do think it’s a good idea to jack the wheels up during storage, especially if you can’t move the trailer around during this time. It also gives you the ability to spin them by hand every now and again to redistribute the grease over the bearings.

And now that I’ve chimed in, now I’ll “chyme” in…

It is also true that if you half-fill your tires with XD-100, you will use half as much air.

- B.

[Kittiwake]

That is a handy summary, seahouse.

I had noticed that, when trailering the Mac 26 at speed immediately after a period of, say, 1 month sitting on its trailer, the first mile or two involved excessive trailer vibration (eg. as manifest by vibration of the trailer fenders seen in rearview mirror) ... and have presumed this was due to transient flat spots in the tires. Given that I generally return the boat to its trailer in between trips, I will opt to skip the delights of putting it up on blocks every time if the major concern is early tire replacement.

Hey, check that - a psychologically healthy decision! Thanks gang.
Kittiwake

[Doupirate]

Seahouse wrote:

From an engineering perspective, the stress applied to a wheel bearing during static loading over the time period and temperatures encountered during overwintering remain well within the range of elastic deformation, and will not enter the range where plastic deformation occurs.

From an engineering perspective, it does happen. The bearing ball then looks like punctured.

If it doesn't happen, why do you recommend blocking the trailer, after pretending it is useless?

I do think it’s a good idea to jack the wheels up during storage

I also have «bearing buddies» on. I grease them full every autumn and in the spring as well. Your boat life hangs on your wheels while trailering....and maybe your family life as well Actually, I firmly believe the trailering time is the time traveling with a Mac carries most risks. A lot more than at sea, for sure....

[NiceAft]

I thought he answered that.

Ironically, it’s the tires that benefit most from being jacked up off the ground and having the load removed from them. I say “ironically” because they are the weak link that is supposed to be elastic (rubber), yet they do undergo (short-term) plastic deformation during storage. Ironically, it’s the tires that benefit most from being jacked up off the ground and having the load removed from them. I say “ironically” because they are the weak link that is supposed to be elastic (rubber), yet they do undergo (short-term) plastic deformation during storage.

Also

It also gives you the ability to spin them by hand every now and again to redistribute the grease over the bearings.

Maybe I'm missing something

Ray

[Doupirate]

Yes, this:

because they are the weak link that is supposed to be elastic (rubber), yet they do undergo (short-term) plastic deformation during storage.

...and this:

It also gives you the ability to spin them by hand every now and again to redistribute the grease over the bearings.

Why? The grease melts like oil? The bearings have a hard time supporting the only weight of the suspended wheels?



Enough with this thread, I don't find it serious anymore.

[Doupirate]

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