Rigging for assymetrical spinnaker

[Rick Westlake]

I'm taking it a step further, using a conventional spinnaker pole on the A-sail. This allows me to bring the luff to windward and sail really deep angles (up to DDW) without wing-on-wing and without being blanketed by the main. I got the idea from the skipper of the boat I race on. We fly an A-sail and rig the pole when deep reaching. This is a best-of-both-worlds scenario using the superior shape of an assymetrical without the limitations, being able to sail it like a symmetrical when needed. Of course, gybing isn't easy, even with a full crew.

Leon, you might want a look at my "Instant Whisker Pole" mod. I got the idea from Larry & Lin Pardey's Self-Sufficient Sailor, and it will effectively give you "another hand" when you need it. (I seem to be doing all of these "single-handed cruiser mods" on Bossa Nova. Well, part of the fun of owning a sailboat is tinkering with it.)

[delevi]

Rick,

Many sailors and many things I read have all said the same thing about spinnaker sheets. Never trap a spinnaker sheet. You don't even tie a stop knot at the end of the sheet. A spinnaker can put a boat in an emergency situation in a hurry. The Mac, even more at risk I think. When you have to dump the sheet, you may really need to dump the sheet and you want nothing in the way of stopping it.

That said, you may consider this for your gybing: Get dead down wind and cut the working sheet loose fast! Be sure to quickly take the wraps off the winch and make sure the line doesn't bind in the car as it exits. Fast is key here. This will take the whole spinnaker forward of the headstay, clew and all. Immediately haul in the lazy sheet, now the new working sheet. If you time it right, you would have performed an outside gybe. The other type (inside gybe) makes you pull the sail around the forestay with all kinds of friction, wraping it and forcing it to unwrap, which is often unsuccessful and there you have yourself a mess. This is easier said than done, and I have had plenty of wraps myself, but I still run 2 sheets and attempt the gybe rather than snuffing the chute. One thing I learned about the sock is to always snuff on the same side of the forestay as where the chute was raised. If it is not on the same side as when you hoisted, whip the lines in front of the forestay to the other side. Otherwise, the whole deal gets caught and up at the forestaay's top coneection point. A common mistake I used to make until fairly recently is to just pull down on the sock lines without looking up. It is only when the pulling became difficutl that I would stop and look up to find a tangled mess.

On whisker poles. I haven't heard of a whisker pole going to the spinnaker clew. If you connect to the tack instead and use a guy combined with tack line, you will have better results. The pole, guy and tack line allow you to pull the whole luff of the spinnaker to windward where it gets clean air. There it will be completely out of the shadow of the mainsal, no matter how deep off the wind you are. The clew will behave very well without any support other than the sheet and the sail will be powered up. By simply supporting the clew without the chute getting clean air, you may only have the illusion of it being full, while it is merely supported and not drawing much air.

Leon

[Rick Westlake]

Many sailors and many things I read have all said the same thing about spinnaker sheets. Never trap a spinnaker sheet. You don't even tie a stop knot at the end of the sheet. A spinnaker can put a boat in an emergency situation in a hurry. The Mac, even more at risk I think. When you have to dump the sheet, you may really need to dump the sheet and you want nothing in the way of stopping it.

If I may say so, that was the other half of the reason for the snatch lead. One quick tug inboard and the sheet is free.

That said, you may consider this for your gybing: Get dead down wind and cut the working sheet loose fast! Be sure to quickly take the wraps off the winch and make sure the line doesn't bind in the car as it exits. Fast is key here. This will take the whole spinnaker forward of the headstay, clew and all. Immediately haul in the lazy sheet, now the new working sheet. If you time it right, you would have performed an outside gybe. The other type (inside gybe) makes you pull the sail around the forestay with all kinds of friction, wraping it and forcing it to unwrap, which is often unsuccessful and there you have yourself a mess. This is easier said than done, and I have had plenty of wraps myself, but I still run 2 sheets and attempt the gybe rather than snuffing the chute. One thing I learned about the sock is to always snuff on the same side of the forestay as where the chute was raised. If it is not on the same side as when you hoisted, whip the lines in front of the forestay to the other side. Otherwise, the whole deal gets caught and up at the forestaay's top coneection point. A common mistake I used to make until fairly recently is to just pull down on the sock lines without looking up. It is only when the pulling became difficutl that I would stop and look up to find a tangled mess.

Here I bow to greater experience. Are you using the cabin-top winches, led back to the genoa tracks? Or have you mounted winches on the coamings, back by the helm?

On whisker poles. I haven't heard of a whisker pole going to the spinnaker clew. If you connect to the tack instead and use a guy combined with tack line, you will have better results. The pole, guy and tack line allow you to pull the whole luff of the spinnaker to windward where it gets clean air. There it will be completely out of the shadow of the mainsal, no matter how deep off the wind you are. The clew will behave very well without any support other than the sheet and the sail will be powered up. By simply supporting the clew without the chute getting clean air, you may only have the illusion of it being full, while it is merely supported and not drawing much air.

Your post is the first time I've heard of the whisker pole going to anywhere but the clew. The way I'd heard it and tried it, the whisker pole is guyed (with a fore-guy and a topping lift) to put the clew exactly where you want it, and it's clipped around the sheet rather than attached to the clew. If you get your best results in San Francisco Bay with the whisker pole on the tack, I can see if I'd benefit in our gentler winds in Annapolis. (It's axiomatic that the chute has to get clean air to power it.)

Thanks, Leon, from me for myself, and for those less-experienced sailors who also need your advice....

[delevi]

I use the OEM winches. No additional winches on my boat, though would be nice.

The reason you haven't heard of a whisker pole controling the luff of the spinnkaer is it is not a whisker pole but a spinnaker pole. A whisker pole does belong on the clew, but the clew of a jib or genoa. There is no reason to whisker a spinnaker, unless you sail wing-on-wing. My spinnaker pole is a heavy duty whisker pole $335 Forespar which for our rigs is sufficient. I wouldn't recommend the $150 pole with plastic fittings. That won't hold up as a spinnaker pole. A symmetrical spinnaker is supported by a pole on the windward side. An assymetrical doesn't need this support, as long as it isn't blanketed by the mainsail. By using a pole on an assymetrical just like one would fly a symmetrical, you aleviate the issue of being blanketed by the main as the the luff is pulled to windward and not blocked. If you have the gear, try it. You will be very pleased.

Your tack line is the foreguy. You rig an afterguy to which you clip the pole. The forward end of the aftergy is tied to the spinnaker tack, as well as the tack line. The tack line (foreguy) and afterguy pull in opposite directions with the pole in the center. Any adjustment to one of the lines requires an equal counter-adjustment to the other. The sheet would also need to be adjusted in synch with the guys.

Good luck. have fun
Leon

[bubba]

Our setup in the cockpit looks like this http://i293.photobucket.com/albums/mm42 ... cleatf.jpg This is some hardwear that was on my wifes old boat but it still work great for our gennaker. It's an adjustiable ratchet block and cam cleat, it's really easy to use. We have added the extra mast hound 20 inches up the mast and a long anchor roller to mount an adjustiable tack line. http://i293.photobucket.com/albums/mm42 ... nakert.jpg With the adjustiable tack line controled from the cockpit (where in the photo you see a rubber tiped fairlead for the gennaker sheet and the yellow line in the adjustiable tack line for the gennaler and the roller furrling line) http://i293.photobucket.com/albums/mm42 ... pinnak.jpg the person flying it does not have to get out of the bhttp://i293.photobucket.com/albums/mm42/bubba26M/Newlongeranchorrollerwithspinnakert.jpgow hatch to launch the spinnaker or bring it down. The advantage of a Choot Scoop spinnaker sock is very important. Feeling comfortable and making it easy to fly a spinnaker/gennaker is very important in having fun sailing.

[Rick Westlake]

My spinnaker pole is a heavy duty whisker pole $335 Forespar which for our rigs is sufficient. I wouldn't recommend the $150 pole with plastic fittings.

Maybe what I really need is a longer whisker-pole ...

[bubba]

Maybe what I really need is a longer whisker-pole ...

Either that or some of that vgra-xd stuff. I really tryed to spell it correct.

[Rick Westlake]

Yeah, not much of a "rise" out of that whisker pole, eh?

Actually, I cut those Forespar tips off my $150 pole (PO equipment) and replaced them with RWO tips.



The cut-off Forespar ends were just too good a photo-op for this thread, though.

[delevi]

Rick,
The fitting looks good but the 1" pole may not be up to the task. I guess if you're willing to risk breaking it, no harm in trying. In light air, it may be ok. The length should be 10.5' (size of the fore triangle.)

[bubba]

In light air we pull up the dagger board and let the boat slip and hold a heading so the gennaker holds the breeze, this method works good in breezes under 5 kt's and no pole needed.

[Loefflerh]

Does anyone have the Part# and price for amasthound (26M)? I emailed BWY, but so far they did not reply and I can't find it in their online catalog!
Thanks Hans

[delevi]

If the hound is for a spinnaker, you don't need to use a Mac part. West Marine has them. You may need to bend the curved fittings a bit for a snug fit, but that is easy to do with a clouple of adjustable wrenches.

Leon

[Loefflerh]

Thank you for the info, that would be an option. However, I would rather have the original part, and it was mentioned earlier in this thread that Bwy has it. Its a bit dissappointing that BWY do not reply to 3 emails, I only get the automatic reply "your message has been read".
Hans

[Hamin' X]

Did you try the phone?

~Rich

[atzserv]

For the BWY Masthound try this number for the part. It shows a picture so you know it is what your looking for.

$24.00

3431-1M0

Gary