Need rocker stopper installation ideas Mac M26

[SkiDeep2001]

Coming to NBC this fall, CSI Macgregor. Nice deduction Sherlock.

[Skipper]

Here's another picture to show you where the shroud rubbed on the mast prior to snapping. For what it's worth, we'll also note that the port spreader was slightly bent (maybe 15 degrees off being straight) but we replaced it at the same time as the snapped shroud.



After reading the recent posts (esp. waternwaves) we're wondering if we should replace both lower shrouds/timbles and at the same time get a different shackle that's made for this application? or should these lower shrouds have been set up like the upper shrouds were (see picture that follows) i.e. with the metal plate extensions that avoid having the timbles directly on the shackle?

[Kelly Hanson East]

you cut off those img tags - can you edit those please??

[Hamin' X]

To make the image show in the post, it should look like the following:

This: {img}[http://i665.photobucket.com/albums/vv14 ... e6_9_0.jpg]{.img}

Should look like this:

Code: Select all

[img]http://i665.photobucket.com/albums/vv14/steveshale/aHALEmastrubonbrokenshroudside6_9_0.jpg[/img]

Just click the Img button at the top of the editing window and paste the link between the ][ brackets.

~Rich

[tangentair]

My Bad guys, the lady was following my terrible directions on how to post images and I used the {} brackets in the example but was obviously not clear in my explaination of the need to replace the {} with the [].
Ron

[Divecoz]

Skipper For whats its worth...... I believe you have the same shackle as most of us have from the factory, on our mast to attach the shrouds.
I sympathize that your area is limited for large bodies of water on which to sail but IMHO as well as others here have stated . Give lots of thought to pulling your boat when not in use. Or at least consider lowering the mast.
These are light built boats for their size , if they were not , they wouldn't be the affordable trailer sailors that are, and so easily towed and rigged.
I am NOT an engineer as several are, here on this board . I can there by, only imagine the kinds of forces being exerted on your boat, under the conditions you describe and after seeing the damage you have attested to with pictures .
No doubt in anyone's mind, the shrouds were far to loose. Heeling over at 40 degree with bare poles and then swinging around the anchor and going back to the other side hour after hour day after day , I would imagine your ageing your boat and rigging severely.
Hopefully those with a lot better backround can help you with this delimma.
New Shrouds adjusted properly and maybe new better stronger spreaders but not a lot heavier $$$.
Rocker Stopppers may help, but too close to the hull / hanging over the sides , doesnt offer them much leverage advantage.
I have anchored out in big winds over night ( 25 to 40 mph) and though the boat clocked quite a bit ( swung around the anchor ) I never heeled as you describe. 5 or 10 degrees Maybe.

[Mrs_Skipper]

Mrs. Skipper here... first of all, THANK YOU ALL so very much for your helpfulness. We definitely don't want a repeat of last year's shroud break, and now it's sounding like maybe the way the shrouds are attached is a big contributor. We'll look forward to hearing what y'all might recommend to reduce the wear and tear potential. I've been scouring the forums for answers to all our other questions and have been ordering all kinds of doo-hickies, like a ball bearing assembly from Blue Water Yachts to make our mast rotate like it should, and a proper 3/8" anchor line to replace the expensive 1/2" we just bought but will return to West Marine. We are very grateful to have found this Web site and amazed and the wonderful information you've all taken the time to post. This will be our second summer with the Mac, and we still have a lot to learn.

I also want to apologize for our faulty picture attachment skills! I think the latest instructions have sunk in... we'll see...

And while I understand the advice to get our boat off of the windy buoy and trailer it around as God intended, it's not so easy for regular people who want to sail at Lake Tahoe. It's really a spectacular place to sail and boat camp but very difficult logistically. If we had an extra million or three in the bank we'd just buy a condo that comes with a slip or a lakefront property in a non-windy location with a buoy... Renting a slip isn't an option -- they only come with properties -- and the homeowners associations forbid renting them out so you see a whole bunch empty or with kayaks in them! Marinas that have buoys they lease out have 5-year waiting lists in general, and we felt very lucky to get one at all. Since the drive from the Carson Valley where we can afford to live up to the launching point on the lake is 45 minutes, white-knuckle, up a steep grade then another 45 minutes of driving through South Lake Tahoe which is choked with traffic all summer, we'd never be able to gface that for just a day of sailing. Plus the boat launch is CRAZEEE with all the motorheads in their Formulas so add another 45 minutes waiting in line for the ramp. Oh yes, starting June 1 we now have Zebra Mussel inspections of every boat that is launched at the Lake, so that will add to the time. (Not that I'm complaining, they found 5 infected boats in the first week of inspections!) Instead of sailing up to 3 times a week with our easy 30-minute drive to our boat, we'd be reduced to an occasional weekend... So we're trying to make the best of a sub-optimal situation.

- Cheryl a.k.a. Mrs. Skipper

[Divecoz]

Well Mrs Skipper , with that said , some solutions just have to be found.
An Anchor snubber helped me . I was in shallow water in SW. FLA. and I have 30 feet of chain so I was able to just use a black truckers bungee in the chain. I pulled up enough chain to literary hook the bungee and cause a loop of sorts . I was causing Slack in the chain that the bungee took the shock for . It made sitting out storms and sleeping at night a lot more tolerable. They sell commercially made anchor snubbers as well. ( for chain and for rode /rope) Think of it as a shock absorber for your anchor/boat.

[Mrs_Skipper]

Great minds think alike Admiral Divecoz!

We're moored on a buoy, and the Skipper designed us a dandy custom mooring line with a rubber snubber incorporated. He was concerned with all the movement on the buoy that the bow eye might get ripped out. He also incorporated a float with a pole sticking up about 3' into the air (can't remember what it's called at the moment) to make it easier to reattach when we return to the buoy -- it was a long reach down to the water!

[Kelly Hanson East]

Cheryl - Im pretty concerned that your rigging is way too loose. Next time you are on the boat, try 'twanging' the shrouds - you should get a good musical note from your upper shrouds and a lower pitch one from your lower shrouds.

If you cant get a note from them, they will fail again - shock loading is the worst on shrouds and will guarantee a failure.

The forestay should be hard to pin when the shrouds are tensioned correctly - if you can pull the furler and put the pin in with one hand, again, I can guarantee your shrouds are too loose.

There is a gauge you can buy to measure tension exactly, but you dont really need it.

[Currie]

Hmmmm,

Skipper and Mrs Skipper (IF that's your REAL names! ). Seeing the wear down one side of the mast smacks of a problem I had with my 2004 M. The mast hound was mouted off-axis at the factory. It was causing uneven shroud tension and a tendency for the mast to rotate in one direction more than the other. It might be worth investigating. I could see my problem very clearly by standing at the base of the mast, rotating it to center, and looking up at the hound. Here's a discussion....

http://www.macgregorsailors.com/forum/v ... ye#p101445

~Bob

[Trouts Dream]

The swing of an anchored Macgregor can be pretty excessive and when the boat swings till its alsmost 90 degrees to the wind the rocking is brutal. When you look at how the boat is designed, as long as the nose is mostly to the wind its just bobbing on the waves.

There have been discussions about setting the anchor line so that the baot will not track through the full range. Try searching anchor and swing for some discussions.

One solution is on this thread.

http://www.macgregorsailors.com/forum/v ... ng#p131379

[Mrs_Skipper]

KH East: Thanks for the tip on "strumming" the shrouds to see if they are tight enough. They certainly were NOT tight enough when we had the break -- we tightened and can just barely get the roller furler pin on now. We'll look at this again when we put the mast up.

Bob: Also a good tip about whether the hound is properly centered... we'll check that too. (We have one of those non-operational rotating masts, but just bought the roller bearing assembly from Blue Water Yachts and installed that. When we got the old washers out, they were deformed and there were lots of metal shavings!)

Trout Dreams: As to movement on anchor, that's not our problem -- we're moored on a buoy all summer. The anchor sail we installed has helped a lot with the swing, but we were considering the rocker stoppers to damp the rocking we still have.

Here's the question to one and all... here is our proposed new lower shroud attachment with additional shackles to relieve the side stress on the thimbles we have with the current setup. Would this be better, and is there any problem with adding these?

Current Setup:


Proposed New Setup:


(Many thanks to tangentair for his help with picture posting protocol!)

Cheers,
Cheryl

[Russ]

We're moored on a buoy, and the Skipper designed us a dandy custom mooring line with a rubber snubber incorporated. He was concerned with all the movement on the buoy that the bow eye might get ripped out. He also incorporated a float with a pole sticking up about 3' into the air (can't remember what it's called at the moment) to make it easier to reattach when we return to the buoy -- it was a long reach down to the water!

Are you mooring your boat to the bow eye? It's strength is questionable for that. Others might have a different opinion, but I wouldn't feel comfortable using it for fear of it being ripped out.

A few years ago there was a tropical storm that hit the NY area and whipped up many moorings causing a LOT of boats to be lost including a friend of mine. After reading the reports, it seems the common factor was the jerking on the mooring lines. The boats were described as bucking ponies on their moorings and that excessive yanking on the lines pulled cleats out, chaffed lines through and even caused anchors on bow rollers to come free and cut lines.

Here's the report from the Fleet Captain of the Raritan Yacht Club.

Some of the aftermath


--Russ

This was my friends boat that ripped it's bow cleats out. He got a call from the Navy that his boat washed up on their pier and had sunk. A $250,000 boat destroyed by lack of shock absorption.

[Divecoz]

That Bow eye is, from what I have been told .......One of the strongest attachments on a boat. It's what they tow your boat with to get you home or ungrounded.
Sea Tow assured of all the places to attach "the hook" that the bow eye would be the strongest??? I believed him as its what he does for a living everyday . With boats smaller than ours to much larger vessels as well .......does anyone have any spec's ? Does ABYC have requirements?Personally I wouldn't attach to a deck cleat and the chain plates are loaded enough as is.......