Ballast Bilge Pump

[Wind Chime]

Has anyone installed a Ballast Bilge Pump?

I have a 15 minute motor from the marina to where I can hoist sail. I always sail with full ballast, and then motor back with ballast valve open to dump as much ballast as I can to save fuel and less load for the 50 hp Suzuki. I motor at 8 knots and this drains a lot of it, but does never dump all the ballast until I pull it out of the water.

I was thinking of installing a bilge pump inside the ballast tank to remove all ballast at the end of each trip.

Any thoughts?

Darry
Windchime

[kmclemore]

Seems like a lot of work for little gain. What's the problem with just draining it while you haul it out?

[Wind Chime]

I notice after I haul out there is still a lot of ballast left. I also hear a very different tone in the engine when it is completely empty compared to when it has this residual ballast.

Last year we spent 2 weeks in the San Juan Islands (Pacific Northwest) half the time motoring and the other half under sail. The whole trip I carried around all this residual ballast, which probably cost a little extra in unnecessary fuel, put additional load on the engine, and maybe even made us a little less stable when facing 3+ foot square wind-over-waves that we have.

[puggsy]

Hi Windchime...I would suggest think safety in respect to ballast. With it in no probs, but without it you could set yourself up for disaster. MACS are virtually bomb proof with the ballast in, tender but safe. Without the ballast you have to be aware of every change of attitude, passing boat wash, lots of unknowns.
A lot depends on your own personal experience.
As to draining, I leave mine until the comes up ther ramp, giving it some angle and it all drains. Dont leave the draining till you are level at the top. Start it as soon as the valve clears the water. Even before that if you are sloping uphill. Puggsy 06

[Wind Chime]

Thanks Puggys,

Regarding draining; yes we open the valve again as soon as I get her at angle on the trailer. Also very difficult for our 2000 Dodge Caravan to pull her plus the the 1300 lbs of ballast up the ramp. The local Yacht Club members some times sit on the deck to watch the site.

I certainly agree how seaworthy she is with full ballast even in large swells and whitecaps, and she can get very corky when empty. Here, we somtines have the Georgia Straight to cross (which is 35 miles at some points) so doing it with empy ballast in good conditons is a plus.

When conditions permit, my thought was after sailing to drain out as much ballast as possible by motoring, then close the valve and pump out the rest.

Maybe I will bring a garbage can next time and measure the ballast as it emptys out on the ramp, to see jsut how is actuly left.

[vkmaynard]

We run the Honda 50 WOT until we reach 17+ mph (4-5 min) and the engine rpm hits about 5600. No rudders or centerboard down. While still at that speed, close the valve. Nearly zero ballast left.

Victor

[Terry]

I have only launched from Crescent Beach a couple times but if memory serves me, it is steep enough to completely empty right there at the ramp. Open the gate before pulling up the ramp (or before even getting the trailer) and come up very slowly so that it is mostly empty before you over strain the vehicle. It can be a bit of a hassle to empty before hand then try to get the last bit out at the ramp because you have to run back and forth from the drivers seat to the transom to open the gate while others are waiting. I doubt there is enough left behind in the ballast when emptying out on the water to impede performance, I have tried to get that last bit out on several occasions by powering up as fast as possible but it seems like a long wait to get the last little dredges out and they cannot amount to more than a gallon at max, if that. I wouldn't worry about it.

[LOUIS B HOLUB]

Ive been tinkering with an idea also, since we keep our boat in a slip. Ive purchased an air mattress pump, which has an attachment that will fit snugly over the front vent hole in my "X" I havent tried this yet, but plan to open the rear gate valve as "minimal as possible" with the air pressure running into the ballast tank through the front vent hole. During this, I will have myself, & admiral & dog, & anyone else available positioned in the rear of the cockpit so the ballast water can flow back and be forced out. When we see nothing but bubbles, I'll assume most of the water has been blown out and then the gate valve can be shut tight.

This idea is something similar to a thread hidden in the archives--which is where I came up with the Pump Idea.

I noticed when previously trailering, quite a bit of water remained in my ballast tank and could be emptied when travelling and/or lifting the nose of the trailer as high as possible.

[Wind Chime]

Victor,

It is good to hear that someone can empty the ballast tank totaly while motoring, so I know it can be done without going to the effort of a internal pump.

We run the Honda 50 WOT until we reach 17+ mph (4-5 min) and the engine rpm hits about 5600. No rudders or centerboard down. While still at that speed, close the valve. Nearly zero ballast left.

My only question is: getting 17+ mph @ 5600 rpm ... that's like 14.5 knots! I would have to throw half of the admirals shoes overboard to get that speed, but as we all know that is not an option to pursue .

I find our good cruising speed is around 10 kts @ 5000 rpm, and we usually top out at around +/- 13.

The next time I am out I will try to get it up to your recommend speed and see if that does the trick. (I may have to use a WOT, go downwind with the current, and downhill . Those extra couple of knts may be the difference.

Darry

[Don T]

Hello,
The trick to an empty ballast tank is allowing the bow to lift on the bow wave, plowing my dad used to call it. Increase your speed a little. My tank is completely empty when I pull the boat out (open both valves and nothing comes out). I don't like even a small amount of water sloshing around, it really changes the boat handling.

PS: headed to the San Juan Is. 6-27 > 7-6.

[Wind Chime]

Thanks Don T,

Sounds like I just have not found the right boat speed and bow angle to remove all the ballast. I will work on it this weekend ... I have to go and pull the crab traps anyway.

Enjoy your trip to the SJ Islands. Wow what a place that is huh! Nothing better to us than a feast of Westcott Bay clams tied up at Roche Harbor.


Terry,

Your memory is correct about Crescent Beach Marina ramp. Very steep, and slippery on an ebb tide. I do open the valve once on the trailer and it does start to drain right away even with the valve under the water line. I then pull up just enough so I can see the water comming out of the valve, always draws a crowd to watch. Someones always asks "is it supposed to do that".

Darry

[hmb-barry]

I use a small 12 volt liquid transfer pump with 5/8 inch hose pieces attached to pump out the ballast for those times that I want to land at the dock with it full - ramp at Princeton is steep, lot of surge and usually windy. The pump was cheap - less than $30.00 (Harbor Freight - 12 volt Utility Water Transfer pump # 94639 o5 9576) and though slow, gets enough ballast out in 20 minutes for my 2000 Ford Windstar to get it high enough on the ramp to drain the rest.
A 4 foot hose in the ballast tank and a longer hose thru the opened hatch for over-the-side discharge. Caution - do not let these pumps run dry - they melt impellers quickly; but it works great.

Barry

[Trouts Dream]

One last point on emptying the ballast completely. The Macs, like men, have a preference to list predominantly to one side or the other. If your Mac lists slightly to port and the drain is on the starboard, some residual water will remain. I have found that a few minor zigs and zags just before closing the ballast can help with completely emptying the ballast.

[Wind Chime]

Good tip Trout .. tks!

Does anyone have a topview schematic of where the ballast tank is on a 2000X?

I know they run lengthwise, and are the narrow upright compartments that can be seen along the port galley and aft sette, and also along the cooler/table area, and then goes aross the bow to the air vent. It also seems to be spread under the aft berth area.

Darry

[RickJ]

Ive purchased an air mattress pump, which has an attachment that will fit snugly over the front vent hole in my "X" I havent tried this yet, but plan to open the rear gate valve as "minimal as possible" with the air pressure running into the ballast tank through the front vent hole.

I also came across the old thread that mentioned this idea, but I couldn't tell if it had actually worked successfully.

Louis - let us know if it works! I just have trouble believing that an air-matress pump has enough oomph to expel the ballast water. It is after all having to push it from below water level.

Cheers, Rick