MacGregorSailors.com

Difficult question to pose intelligently because of variations of use/abuse, salt vs fresh, even definition of end of life...

But I realised Catigale is 5 seasons old and in my mind when I bought her I convinced myself 10 years was a reasonable lifetime expectation.

Ive kept the boat up decently, but not meticulously.

Im rethinking that 15 years doesnt look unreasonable given the way things seem to wear out.

I wonder how boats of this type (trailerables) end up 'dying' -

lack of use - rot
Damage from accident
Hull failure - either lamination or large structural cracks
any others??

Ive wondered about the same question, and have looked closely at boats built in the 1960s-1970s-1980s just for comparison. Im amazed at the durability of a fiberglass boat if its cared for "reasonably well". IMO - these boats should be around 50 years - plus. Considering the quality of paints and upgradeable materials -- Our great grandkids will be enjoying our Macs, reading our logs, and admiring our Macs in many years to come. Thats one reason Im careful about what is entered into the boat log...heh heh...
I hope some other OPINIONs are expressed in this thread--

My impression is that most boats die of neglect. The original user/owner for some reason no longer uses it - because of death, illness, change of life circumstances, whatever - and the boat ends up sitting in their back yard for years on end. Eventually the elements start to take their toll - the boat cover rots apart, the boat's glass gets chalked beyond hope, dirt and debris gets into every crevice, water accumulates inside the cabin breeding mold and mildew, stuff gets banged into it making cracks and soon all the important bits get lost (gee.. I can't seem to find the sails anymore, and were did we put that boom?). Ultimately, it pretty much becomes a pit that's seemingly beyond hope - or beyond financial reason - to bring back from the dead. So, nobody wants it and it gets hauled off to the junk man.

As far as how long they *can* last, well, our Boston Whaler Harpoon is a 1979 model and it still looks great - the golden mahogony woodwork looks beautiful, the f'glass is still shiny and there's only a few thin stress cracks, all the stainless bits are still bright and in good working order, and apart from the spar's anodizing being a fairly flat and the warning decals being faded, you might think it was a fairly new boat. In terms of performance, it sails beautifully and I'd happily match it against anything made today for ease of sailing and even speed.

So.. how long CAN they last? Basically forever, with good care. My Dad and I bought that Harpoon back in 1982 and we both lovingly doted on it - re-did the woodwork twice, always kept it waxed and covered, etc. I plan to pass it on to my children, and with luck, perhaps even to my grandchildren!

MY previous experience is with slightly heavier buily boats:

1965 Hinterhoeller Shark 24 Still going strong..not very much to look at any more but easily cleaned up..deck woodwork should all be replaced. This boat was first constructed in plywood 6 were built and demand was there for newer construction, they went on to build in fiberglass my hull is # 136, thousands were made..same design is made under licence in germany today
A MUST READ!
http://www.shark24.org/membership/whatisas.htm


1979 Sirius 21 swing keel on loan to my brother...could use 2 new cushions in cabin where they always get stepped on climbing in from cockpit (imagine mac x layout without enclosed head, dinette seat gets used instead of ladder)
This boat seems to be in as good a condition as my 99x, I think it was better built. Has positive foam floatation under v berth and between hbull and liner making her a well insulated ( stays much cooler on a hot day) boat is also very quiet in cabin.
http://sailquest.com/market/models/sirius.htm


1971 shetland 535 british built 17'cabin cruiser...goofly little boat but i cand bear to get rid of her,good condition..check her out
http://www.shetlandboats.co.uk/shetland535.htm


I don't believe my 99x will last like these have..construction was a bit on the cheap side..I understand why and therefore am not knocking it. I hope 20 years is not unrealistic.

I will say that with my mac I got more use from her last summer than I had from any of the others in 3 seasons. It's not as good a boat but for me is better. On calm days we go out for a cruise, with wind we sail.
I've followed the bigger motor threads with interest but am not inspired to upsize from my 50hp merc bigfoot.

I LOVE MY MAC

My first boat was a 1971 Venture 21. These were what Roger called his early boats before he decided to name them after himself. I'm sure they were built with the same low cost approaches that he still uses today. I bought it in 1994, it was in good shape then and is still in good shape today. I sold it to my sister when I bought the X. I think if the boat is kept on a trailer, and resonably cared for it will last a very long time.

how do you dispose of an old FG boat when no one wants it even as a gift?

Charity

Last night I had some folks on the boat for beers. They were amazed it is 10 years old.....the X is a beauty still and I don't see her aging any faster in the near future....my buddy has a 25(80's) down the dock...still a beautiful boat...I will have the X until it or I die, most likely...I can't find a boat more perfect for my needs and uses...... Randy

Well, from 1st hand experience, I know that my 1973 Mac Venture 224, is still out and about as it is featured in a website that I can't find right now. I just recently sold my 1976, and although the PO had painted the thing with a brush, easy to maintain if scaped, but still horrible looking, but it worked!

One of the claims Roger made in his sales pitch is that the 1954 GRP Corvettes are still around.....and they are!

I'd say at this point, it is simply an unknown just how long GRP boats will be around! Similar examples are bakelite, and products manufactured from this material are still around from the early part of the last century!

Unless Roger is forced to reformulate his GRP, so that it self destructs like most modern formulas, I can see these things go several generations into the future, probably for much longer than a similar wood boat, properly cared for! And as most of you know, I dislike anything wood around my boat! Too much maintenance IMHO! I love my Clorox bottle! See ~ ://www.americanplasticscouncil.org/s_apc/sec.asp?

We have a gem in San Diego called the Star of India, a 19th century (1863) Steel Sailing vessel. I guess most materials can and will last if properly cared for! See ~ http://www.sdmaritime.org/contentpage.asp?ContentID=48

See ~ http://www.americanplasticscouncil.org/ ... 10&DID=920

I agree with KMC, Not only boats but most things die of neglect. My Boat is a 97 and with the exception of a tiny bit of cusion sag it looks like it was just unwrapped on christmas '97.

My maintainance program may be a tiny bit over the top for some and is not designed to allow me to keep it forever, however I do want to maximize my resale when I do upgrade and I prefer my mechanical toys to be in perfect working order. I cant stand haveing to dink with something mid season.

Right now, 9+ years after manufacture, I could use new foam for the seats, my stock jib is a little long for this world and I have 2 chips and a scratch I will repair before the middle of season. Other than that, perfector better than new working order.

The laundry list of stuff I have put onto my boat in the way of pure maintainance is long but compare that to boat payments on a higher dollar boat that you would have to do the same stuff too and I figure Im dollars ahead by a large margin.

The "ELISSA" was built in 1877, found as a neglected beat up iron and wood boat, and remodeled by a buncha hard working historians. Now its the pride of Galveston, Texas where it's kept. Three tall masts, and a real "work of art". It even sailed from Galveston to the N.Y. Harbor in the Tall Ships Parade July 4, 1986, and was the oldest of the 22 Class A Tall Ships in the N.Y. parade. She still looks great !! A real "must see" for sailing folks...A recent local newspaper showed a photo of her sailing off the coast of Galveston last month...looked real nice !

ronacarme wrote:how do you dispose of an old FG boat when no one wants it even as a gift?

Once a week our local paper has an advertising section for free stuff. I had an old motor boat I advertised in this section. It was old, the trailer was bent, the motor was shot, the seats were torn, the fiberglass was faded; in the ad, I described the boat pretty much this way.

Only my phone number was printed in the ad. When I came home from work, to my surprise, there was a guy waiting for me at the end of the driveway. I live in a small town. He went to the local gas station and browsed every phone number until he found mine. He then cross referenced it to my address. He hauled away the junker boat. On my telephone answering machine, there were about 15 messages for the boat.

I think mine will last as long as my pride of ownership does. I will admit it requires major TLC's to keep it looking nice but I view it more as an investment than I would an automobile.
For example: a year ago February I bought a used 1994 Lincoln Mark VIII for about $3000.00 Cdn, in 1994 they cost between $55K & 60$K (we pay more for cars here than people in the US do). The current market value here in Vancouver is about $5k for a '94 Mark VIII, I got a decent deal. The cars are barely worth 10% of their original value today, even if in good shape. Cars are about the worst investment there is aside from the collectibles and if the Mark VIII becomes a classic collectible then I stand to recover my costs.
Now, look at boats as an alternative to cars and you have something worth looking after and maintaining. Used Macs command a good price here and are hard to find, not that many for sale at any given time to choose from. As an investment they fare much better than cars, even after 10 years I expect to recover 50 cents on the dollar for mine. and I expect to have it at least that long, health permitting. I will confess that this year the amount of work I put in has caused me some re-evaluation as to how long I can keep it, it is a lot of work (cost too but I have little else to spend on). I think as long as one takes pride in maintaining their Mac they can outlast a car.
I also have noticed that a Mac commands a better resale price relative to how many options/mods have been added moreso than some vehicles that are option loaded.
Aside from the investment perspective I have yet to discover any vehicle that provides the return in enjoyment that a boat does, even my canoe does better than a car. (yes, I have done some 4-wheel excursions) I don't think your Doctor or even the illegal drug trade can provide anything that even comes close to the euphoria that sailing (or any boating, canoeing included) provides.

21' MacGregor Venture 21, Year: 1980

http://www.yachtworld.com/core/listing/ ... earchtype=

$ 2000 and it is yours.

how do you dispose of an old FG boat when no one wants it even as a gift?

Chainsaw



On edit - James' post and Greg TX (see Pub) post are timely on this topic...indeed the 10 year number I had in my head was probably at least 2x conservative....Gee honey, that makes the boat even cheaper!!