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Hi All,
I have the 1996 and it does have vent and a ballast fill valve under the step. I have been thinking og doing a mod to get rid of it. That step is an ankle buster.

tp56ihs wrote:Hi All,
I have the 1996 and it does have vent and a ballast fill valve under the step. I have been thinking og doing a mod to get rid of it. That step is an ankle buster.

Let me know if you want me to post you any photos of that particular point

Dear friends, I am back again.
I have some questions again. Please recall that the previous owner removed all sail related rigging 2000

News
The mast is up
Question: The top of the mast should have a cover or not? When I was cleaning the whole thing, I found a lot of bird nesting material in there

Side Stay Adjusters
I cannot find enough Stay Adjusters and some are broken However, I have more than I would usually need (I think) of good quality (SS316/A4) "pipe turnbuckles". May I assume that the previous owner replaced the Stay Adjusters with Turnbuckles? The side shrouds are now relatively close to each other, as opposed to the original setting shown in the instructions manual (2002, p.9). Will this new setup cause any troubles?

Backstay
The Backstay seems to be shorter by a 1.5' (45cm) even by full extending a stay adjuster +half of extra stay adjuster. Is this correct? For the moment I have used an additional piece of SS wire (with a thimble and a snap hook) found available in the boxes that makes the whole thing fit. Does this makes sense to you?

Mast Raising System
I found the mast raising pole attachment in one of the boxes handed to me . I guess this system was installed (instr. manual 2002, p10). I also have two extra poles similar to those that go along the Forestay for the furling system mechanisms. They do not seem to be relevant. Would someone please post photos of the mast raising system?
a) what pole(s) are used (diameter, length)?
b) attachments, blocks?
c) what and how lines are used?

Eco,

Yes, Pictures Please

Thanks
Tom

eco wrote:News
The mast is up
Question: The top of the mast should have a cover or not? When I was cleaning the whole thing, I found a lot of bird nesting material in there

I don't believe the mast originally had any sort of plug or cover. Mine has an aluminium plate welded (poorly) inside, but that wasn't OEM, AFAIK. IYKWIM?

eco wrote:Side Stay Adjusters
I cannot find enough Stay Adjusters and some are broken However, I have more than I would usually need (I think) of good quality (SS316/A4) "pipe turnbuckles". May I assume that the previous owner replaced the Stay Adjusters with Turnbuckles? The side shrouds are now relatively close to each other, as opposed to the original setting shown in the instructions manual (2002, p.9). Will this new setup cause any troubles?

BWY has the stay adjusters. You have to buy male and female ends separately, but if buying new shrouds from them, the male half is incorporated. Turnbuckles can't take the beating that the vernier type adjusters can, and being a trailer sailboat, they will take a beating in handling when handling the rigging to set up and take down the mast.

eco wrote:Backstay
The Backstay seems to be shorter by a 1.5' (45cm) even by full extending a stay adjuster +half of extra stay adjuster. Is this correct? For the moment I have used an additional piece of SS wire (with a thimble and a snap hook) found available in the boxes that makes the whole thing fit. Does this makes sense to you?

You may need to revisit the mast rake. The X has more rake by design than any other sailboat I'm familiar with. The more rake, the shorter the back stay.

eco wrote:Mast Raising System
I found the mast raising pole attachment in one of the boxes handed to me . I guess this system was installed (instr. manual 2002, p10). I also have two extra poles similar to those that go along the Forestay for the furling system mechanisms. They do not seem to be relevant. Would someone please post photos of the mast raising system?
a) what pole(s) are used (diameter, length)?
b) attachments, blocks?
c) what and how lines are used?

a) I think it's a 2" dia. pole, but I can check that when I go to the boat later, as I leave it on the boat so I know where it is. About 6 feet long. Wall thickness I would have to measure. Aluminium for weight, but no reason you can't use steel, like EMT (thin wall electrical conduit).
b) An eye strap on both side of one end, with through bolts so the load passes through the bolts and not into the pole. The fork hardware at the other end, also through bolted.
c) A set of fiddle blocks are mostly commonly used, and you can use the boom vang or main sheet system to do this. One end to the top of the MRS pole (eye strap), and the other to the eye strap on the cabin roof, just aft of the anchor locker (should already be there). You'll need to use a cabin roof winch and jamb cleat to hold it, though, as with only 4 parts of line and those small, plain-bearing (sleeve) sheaves, it takes a fair bit of force on the live end. Use the jib halyard to connect to the eye strap on the MRS. Set it up with the MRS pole vertical or even a little toward the stern so you don't run out of room between the blocks as it reaches the top.

Baby stays to keep the mast from falling over sideways. Hopefully, they're already there, too.

Hi Eco,

I'll add my $0.02 to your conundrum.
Mast caps may or may not be installed. Some, like mine have their anchor light mounted to the inside of the mast which negates the ability to cap it. I do however have a multi wire anti-bird device similar to this: http://www.defender.com/product.jsp?pat ... id=1816676 installed to keep the little winged critters from nesting.

As for the stay adjusters, a few folks have gone to marine grade turn buckles which are fine if your storing mast up. If you're trailering like us you may want to stay with the original adjusters.

The backstay should be all one piece and quite slack unless sailing down wind. If this isn't the case with yours I would recommend ordering a stock replacement from BWY.

If you have the original MRS for the it should consist of a pole about 1 1/4" in diameter and roughly 4' in length. I'm just guessing here but those measurements should be close. Use a halyard to attach to the mast side of the pole and your fiddle blocks between the pole and bow. The original line length is 52' but I found that too short to be able to put any amount of tension on the mast while attaching the furler. I replaced mine with a much longer no-stretch halyard line off ebay. I would recommend around 60' of line.

I hope this helps clear some of your questions up.
Happy sailiing!

Fair Winds,
Capt. Azzarac
Chameleon
Follow Chameleon's travels at: http://svchameleon.weebly.com/

eco wrote: Backstay
The Backstay seems to be shorter by a 1.5' (45cm) even by full extending a stay adjuster +half of extra stay adjuster. Is this correct? For the moment I have used an additional piece of SS wire (with a thimble and a snap hook) found available in the boxes that makes the whole thing fit. Does this makes sense to you?

Your backstay may be short so that you can have an adjuster.

Jeff

tp56ihs wrote:Eco,

Yes, Pictures Please

Thanks
Tom

OK, here it is (relevant to the "no vent under the step":


p.s. Trying to make it work with photobucket

!	Moderator Note:
	I have fixed your image links. With Google drive, you must copy the download link, not the share link. You are using Google Drive, not PhotoBucket. ~Rich---Hamin' X~

Tomfoolery wrote: ... I don't believe the mast originally had any sort of plug or cover.

OK, thank you. Here is a photo of mine:

Tomfoolery wrote: ...vernier type adjusters can, and being a trailer sailboat, they will take a beating in handling when handling the rigging to set up and take down the mast.

I will keep it in mind. Those pipe turnbuckles look strong enough though. They are not the 1/4" (6mm) diameter type but the larger size of 5/16" (8mm) diameter.

Tomfoolery wrote: ...You may need to revisit the mast rake. The X has more rake by design than any other sailboat I'm familiar with. The more rake, the shorter the back stay.

I would think that this maybe the case since I did not add the furling mechanism on yet, but still from what I see it would make no difference. Anyway for the moment I added an extension using stay adjuster and a short cable found available.

Backstay cable diameter
Please let me know the backstay cable diameter you have. Mine is 1/8" (3.25mm) including the extension cable mentioned earlier.

Other cables diameter
Forestay has a 0.1968" (5mm) diameter.
Shrouds have a 0.1575" (4mm) diameter.
Baby stays have a 1/8"=0.125" (3.2mm) diameter.
Would someone please confirm?

About the Mast Raising System (MRS)

Tomfoolery wrote: a) I think it's a 2" dia. pole, but I can check that when I go to the boat later, as I leave it on the boat so I know where it is. About 6 feet long. Wall thickness I would have to measure. Aluminium for weight, but no reason you can't use steel, like EMT (thin wall electrical conduit).

I found Stainless Steel 304 and 316 pipes at the local store at those diameters. Also found anodized Aluminum, Alloy 6060, but I am not sure if it is structurally OK (feedback welcome ). I assume that you will decline a thick wall plastic pipe

Tomfoolery wrote: b) An eye strap on both side of one end, with through bolts so the load passes through the bolts and not into the pole. The fork hardware at the other end, also through bolted.

I believe I have what you called "the fork hardware" at the base where the mast attaches. Please send me photos of the other end.

Tomfoolery wrote: c) A set of fiddle blocks are mostly commonly used, and you can use the boom vang or main sheet system to do this. One end to the top of the MRS pole (eye strap), and the other to the eye strap on the cabin roof, just aft of the anchor locker (should already be there). You'll need to use a cabin roof winch and jamb cleat to hold it, though, as with only 4 parts of line and those small, plain-bearing (sleeve) sheaves, it takes a fair bit of force on the live end. Use the jib halyard to connect to the eye strap on the MRS. Set it up with the MRS pole vertical or even a little toward the stern so you don't run out of room between the blocks as it reaches the top.

Please send photos I have not managed to get a clear picture on all these from the manual(s)

Tomfoolery wrote: Baby stays to keep the mast from falling over sideways. Hopefully, they're already there, too.

I have those

! Moderator Note: wrote:
I have fixed your image links. With Google drive, you must copy the download link, not the share link. You are using Google Drive, not PhotoBucket.

~Rich---Hamin' X~

OK thank you. I used the Google Drive until I could figure out how to use the PhotoBucket as the other people here, but since you pointed a solution, there is no need to transfer photos over to PhotoBucket now

eco wrote:Backstay cable diameter
Please let me know the backstay cable diameter you have. Mine is 1/8" (3.25mm) including the extension cable mentioned earlier.

Other cables diameter
Forestay has a 0.1968" (5mm) diameter.
Shrouds have a 0.1575" (4mm) diameter.
Baby stays have a 1/8"=0.125" (3.2mm) diameter.
Would someone please confirm?

Forestay and backstay are both 1/8" dia. 1x19 wire rope. Side stays (shrouds) are 5/32" dia. 1x19 wire rope.

Mast rake information is in the manual, which you can download from the 'Resources' tab at the top of the page, if you haven't already.

eco wrote:About the Mast Raising System (MRS)

Tomfoolery wrote: a) I think it's a 2" dia. pole, but I can check that when I go to the boat later, as I leave it on the boat so I know where it is. About 6 feet long. Wall thickness I would have to measure. Aluminium for weight, but no reason you can't use steel, like EMT (thin wall electrical conduit).

I found Stainless Steel 304 and 316 pipes at the local store at those diameters. Also found anodized Aluminum, Alloy 6060, but I am not sure if it is structurally OK (feedback welcome ). I assume that you will decline a thick wall plastic pipe

It's 1-1/2" dia. x 1/8" wall x 6 ft long aluminium, probably 6061, which is very common. Online Metals sells it via the internet, but there are many sources, of course. I would stick with aluminium unless weight isn't an issue, but it is rather pricey for a length of tube, which has to be shipped. EMT (electrical thinwall conduit) is pretty light, even in 1-1/2" dia., and is a popular choice for many, and is readily available in any home improvement box store, hardware store, and of course, contractor supply house.

For the eyestraps, look at Photo 23 of the manual. Eyestraps should have a SWL of at least 400 lb. They mount at the end of the pole, on opposite sides, and are through-bolted the same way the 'fork' is through-bolted, using long machine screws. The two eye strap holes are 90 degrees to the holes for the 'fork' at the bottom, so one eye strap faces forward (with the pole straight up), and the other aft. Photos 22, 23, and 24 show the attachment to the boat, to the halyard. I don't think I have any photos of my own of the system in place, but I'll search around to see if some are buried somewhere.

About Mast Raising System

Tomfoolery wrote: It's 1-1/2" dia. x 1/8" wall x 6 ft long aluminium, probably 6061, which is very common. Online Metals sells it via the internet, but there are many sources, of course. I would stick with aluminium unless weight isn't an issue, but it is rather pricey for a length of tube, which has to be shipped. EMT (electrical thinwall conduit) is pretty light, even in 1-1/2" dia., and is a popular choice for many, and is readily available in any home improvement box store, hardware store, and of course, contractor supply house.

Thank you!!! Great help
Here is some information found (on Wiki) for the sake of other readers:
Alloy 6061: max Tensile Strength=18,000 psi (125 MPa), and max Yield Strength=8,000 psi (55 MPa).
Alloy 6060: max Tensile Strength=20,000 psi (140 MPa), and max Yield strength=10,000 psi (70 MPa).
Therefore, given the dimensions you gave me and considering a 6061 alloy, the MRS pole should have a max pure compressive strength of 4,320 lbs (1,960 kg), without considering buckling capacity or fastener holes or other defaults (SWL is less than this).
Does anyone know what aluminum alloy is the mast of ? (just curious)

Tomfoolery wrote: For the eyestraps, look at Photo 23 of the manual. Eyestraps should have a SWL of at least 400 lb. They mount at the end of the pole, on opposite sides, and are through-bolted the same way the 'fork' is through-bolted, using long machine screws. The two eye strap holes are 90 degrees to the holes for the 'fork' at the bottom, so one eye strap faces forward (with the pole straight up), and the other aft. Photos 22, 23, and 24 show the attachment to the boat, to the halyard. I don't think I have any photos of my own of the system in place, but I'll search around to see if some are buried somewhere.

Yes I have various manuals. It seems that you are referring to the 1996 version found here as well. The photo(s) are not clear , and that is why I keep asking for more photos. I hope I am not becoming a nuisance I really need some close up photos if possible, from any reader available.

I did a static force analysis a couple of years ago, and came up with about 360 lb compressive force in the tube. Buckling strength (theoretical) was far higher than that, as I recall. Something like 2000 lb, if I'm remembering correctly.