MacGregorSailors.com

We're a 3-4. We sail & power our boat almost exclusively on quiet inland lakes in warm weather, and almost never take it out in foul weather, so our risk is somewhat lower. As for my own kids, both of them are competitive swimmers and are pretty much like fish in the water, so I'm not quite as concerned about them - however, having said that, if I do suspect things might get even the slightest bit dicey, on they go. I also require them for anyone doing any sort of skiing, tubing or boarding, and for any kid guests. Adult guests get to make their own decision, though I will encourage them to wear one and certainly they are easily at hand.

Hey Kevin! ... cold water makes a big difference, but I see you don't have that issue.

( BTW - missed you for some months now, welcome home! )

Thanks, Frank... I really appreciate the welcome back.

Yeah, it seems like months to me, too. After the events of the past month* things are getting quieter and I've finally got time to 'get away' mentally by coming here here to kibbitz... a mini vacation...

As for the warm water, you're right. If it were cold water, the PFD's would be worn - I consider cold H2O to be a potentially dangerous situation.


*For those of you who didn't know him, let me introduce my Dad who left Earth to reunite with my mom on Dec. 29th.)

For me it is a bit of how would I feel if something really bad happened to someone on my boat that could have prevented by something as simple as wearing a PFD. Maybe that is a bit too worrisome but I couldn't live with myself if something drastic happened that was so easy for me to prevent. Kind of like not wearing your seatbelt in a car.

I have known people who went overboard in good weather conditions just by doing something stupid. I have friends whose relatives have died by not wearing a PFD in "good" conditions. Such as - bonking their head and were knocked out on their way overboard.

People can, and will, do as they see fit. They should have that choice. I just choose to play it safe. The cost is so little and the potential benefit so huge.

It can be a vexing question. On the one hand, being on the water is fun, whilst being encumbered by a flotation device is not. I capsized a 16' trailer sailer one-design that I used to race many years ago and was grateful that I was not wearing a PFD, with all of the sheets, rigging, sails and stuff all floating around looking for something to get tangled in. I was able to get the sails down, secure the loose stuff, and get the tow line on to right the boat BECAUSE I didn't have a PFD on. Of course, that was a race that had people watching from a base station and a rescue boat patrolling the course,etc.

On the other hand of course are the reasons already mentioned that more-or-less mandate the use of a device, such as awkward wind/sea conditions, water temperature, etc. Folks shouldn't fool themselves though. If you need a PFD, you need a PFD1.

Interestingly, the Maritime authority of the State of Victoria here in Oz has just released revised rules for the wearing of PFDs on all categories of water craft. For trailer yachts and yachts, they pretty much follow the common sense apporach that most people would adopt, ie; kids all the time whilst not below deck, everyone else during rough conditions, or after dark, or when more than three miles offshore, or when solo/short handed. It was already manadatory to carry a PFD1 for all people on board at all times.


Whilst I do not disagree with any of these rules per se', I just don't like it when something like boating becomes too regulated. Yes, there are many people who blithely charge into a water environment without any understanding, or experience and rely on emergency services to get them out of bother. But there are also many people who have developed an understanding of the water, the weather, and their own capabilities with their boat over many years who are quite unecessarily caught in officialdom's desire to regulate anything that looks like it might be fun or dangerous. It's a shame that debates such as the one on this thread are ultimately useless because sooner, or later there will be a rule telling you exactly what you can and cannot do.

It's a shame that debates such as the one on this thread are ultimately useless because sooner, or later there will be a rule telling you exactly what you can and cannot do.

I dont think the debate is useless - in the States we have a long tradition of ignoring the laws we dont like and following the ones we do, with particular glee for ignoring the laws designed to 'protect us against ourselves"

I dont agree with some of the scenarios posted against wearing PFDs. In the case of a capsize, this is a traumatic event with a likely outcome of shock, likely head impact with something hard on a boat, and a PFD will be a lifesaver. Being able to get the boat stood back up is not a rationale for not wearing a PFD imho. Once you survive the knockdown, you can slip out of it of course, to do the necessary stuff underwater.

I was a Boy Scout. Be prepared. If someone sails with me, they will wear floation.

There are too many stories out there about freak storms or wind and someone ends up overboard. I do not do statistical analysis that "under this condition or that" you do not need to wear a device. Be prepared, anything can happen and human life is not worth the gamble.

I am in the Number 1 category, where both myself and my sailing partner wear the belt PFD with the CO2 inflater at all times onboard. As mentioned before, after awhile, you forget you have it on, but it is there when needed.

The State of Nevada boating laws require youngsters 12 years of age and under MUST wear a PFD when up on deck. So that settles that discussion quickly when the youngsters come aboard.

Adult guests are given a PFD when they come aboard to size it to themselves, confirm they can put it on correctly, and either put on when up on deck or not. I don't insist when the weather conditions are forcasted favorable. I point out, however, that a Coast Guard inspector usually requires that you can locate and put on a PFD in 20 seconds. I don't know if that true, but it makes them keep it handy in the cabin if they don't put it on,

Whenever conditions require reefing the main sail and reducing the size of the head sail, that is a mandatory "don PFD" order. Usually that can be anticipated before leaving the dock, but not always.

I usually try to have an MOB drill with the throwable cushion PFD with floating line, with all the guest to make sure that they can at least STOP the boat should either my sailing partner AND myself fall over board.

Now my closest encounter with being the MOB

Coming back sailing single handed from Greg Basin towards Temple Bar Marina in the narrows between those two points on Lake Mead NV. I had lowered my hank on Jib, but it was catching the wind up on the foc'sle. The wind was about 10 knots and steady on the nose with the Main up and the O/B motor a 1/2 Throttle. I when forward to muzzle the sail with bungies to the life line. My 250lbs of weight going forward on the Port side caused the boat to veer in a circle, with me hanging on to the Starboard gunnel spread eagle across the foc'sle . Was able to crawl back to the wheel and sort things out. Was in the company of other boats and wearing my belt PFD, but if MOB, I suspect he boat would have run over me

LESSON: Don't go forward with Main up and Motoring when single handed sailing. Drop Main, tie the wheel, set motor at slowest speed if possible. I was reluctant to do that with the narrowness of the channel and high walls funnelling the wind from dead ahead. Big mistake

The bottom line is that of all the deaths caused from going overboard 85% of the victims were not wearing a PFD. They only work if you are wearing one.