New Tow Vehicle

[tuxonpup]

Forgot to mention we upgraded as well.



Powerful enough that we hardly feel the boat back there, somewhat offset by a 300 mile towing range. Nice to be able to run the power washer from the truck A/C outlet.

Nice truck! Moving from my hybrid Escape to a straight gas vehicle was a tough choice, but there isn't really any electric towing capability in the sub-$30k market I was shopping in. Our nearest sailing destinations for the next few years are Lake Powell 6 hours North, San Diego 6 hours West and San Carlos, Mexico 6 hours South, all long tows through open desert. Ah well, at least we've got the electric scooter charging in the bed, so kinda hybrid?

[Piddle and Futz]

Yeah, we went from an 8 cylinder Chevy Avalanche (good range but terrible efficiency, such that we ended up leaving the tow vehicle stored in Corpus Christi with the boat, rather than drive it back and forth to Austin), to a Volvo XC90 plug-in hybrid (surprisingly strong and better efficiency, mostly electric when not towing, but small gas tank also requiring 2 refueling stops on a 250 mile trip), to finally the Rivian (fantastic tow vehicle for shorter hauls).

I guess the real story here is that the admiral only let me buy the Rivian if I agreed to get rid of the Chevy, the Volvo, and 2 other convertibles. So far it has been totally worth it. We may have a different story to tell when we tow the boat to the keys in a year or 2.

[leefrankpierce]

I am wondering how the chassis/suspension/brakes handle the load.
Just because it can move it, it may not be safe.
I consider my 1/2 ton 4wd suburban minimum, not sure I would use a 1/2 ton empty truck.

Of course I am in Texas so 80mph in traffic is expected, driving conditions may define what is safe.
If I could stay on side roads, a car as advertised might be usable.

[Starscream]

I guess the real story here is that the admiral only let me buy the Rivian if I agreed to get rid of the Chevy, the Volvo, and 2 other convertibles. So far it has been totally worth it. We may have a different story to tell when we tow the boat to the keys in a year or 2.

Welcome fellow EV-hauler. Sadly still not a good option for long distance towing, as stops are too frequent and pull-through charging stations are non-existant. But local towing 60 miles round trip could not be any better and uses maybe 1/3 of a "tank" (which costs us less than $5 in electricity .



We kept our Pathfinder for it's 8-seat capacity (4 kids plus one grandchild would already fill all the seats in the Lightning) and its 6k lb tow rating, for those long trips into northern NY and Vermont, or Ontario, where we just aren't ready for the hassle of EV towing. The 6k tow rating was important for us and this was the only normal-sized SUV that had more than 5k rating.

[OverEasy]

Hi All!

Great discussion!

What I don’t get is the lack of hybrid trucks in the market .
This would seem to be an ideal segment of the market that would benefit from the abilities of a hybrid platform.
A 4-door truck is a great compromise for a family , functionality and utility as demonstrated by their popularity.
Nothing against an all electric pickup truck but as StarScream pointed out it’s utility and functionality is range limited.
Folks travel, it’s a big country! Folks with trucks haul and tow stuff.
When going on a trip one would want to travel with the family and bring stuff to where they are going.
The interior room, cargo capacity, ground clearance AND towing capacity that a truck offers.
Why limit its range functionality to the availability of where a charging station is at???
The full on lack of pull trough chargers anywhere is an obvious detriment.

A hybrid truck option would solve the issue.
Best of both worlds!
How many people can actually afford two utility vehicles … one electric and one gas?

The local day-to-day around home travel to/from work, grocery and such can be done with charge stations or at home.
The longer distances and towing are where a hybrid would really shine…
The Self charging of a hybrid is a functionality wherever (on the go or out away from charging stations) is what I’d have thought to be a great draw to those looking at a truck.

There are no perfect answers… compromise is generally the best and most durable solution to most things in life.
There’s a reason there aren’t many Puritans…….

I just can’t help but wonder…..

Best Regards,
Over Easy

[Piddle and Futz]

Ah, the promise of the perfect hybrid that meets all needs. That thought really appeals to the engineer in me, but it is a bit of a unicorn in reality and is a compromise that optimizes nothing and results in just OK for a lot of things.

For our use case of only occasionally trailering our , the Volvo plug in hybrid was pretty great. 400 horsepower when we needed it. No worries about charging stations, but the gas tank was pretty small. We ended up storing gas cans on the trailer neck for long hauls because pulling through at some gas stations was also a hassle with 30 feet of trailer.

My real issue with it was that it wasn't a great daily vehicle (<20 miles electric range and <30mpg). I also still needed a truck for ranch work, so I was paying insurance for multiple cars. That's expensive these days.

I had the opportunity to get the EV truck (rescued from salvage for $30k) and it is a great vehicle for things I do every day. It is admittedly not a great long distance tow vehicle. That is a rare use case for us. We have talked about trailering our Mac to Florida or to Montana in our retirement to stay there for a month or 2. That will either require careful route planning and taking extra time on the road to charge, or perhaps renting a pickup.

For those who trailer more often or longer distances, an ICE truck or SUV makes much more sense.

Hybrids combine the complexity, weight and cost of both ICE and EV vehicles, making them less reliable and less efficient than either pure ICE or EV versions. A good way to think of hybrid vehicles as analogous to multitools. Multitools are wonderful, but you wouldn't want to use a multitool to fillet a dozen fish, screw in a hundred deck boards, or wire a house. You'd want to use a tool specialized for those tasks. Multitools and hybrids are designed to be useful at a lot of things. As "Jacks of all trades" they are masters of none. The price they pay for being good at a lot of things is that they are great at no one thing. They have a definite place in the world (I certainly never want to be without a multitool), I just decided that hybrid wasn't optimal for my daily needs.

[OverEasy]

Hi PiddleandFutz!

Yes, I agree with you, the right hybrid is sort of a multi tool… sorta like a Mac26X and Mac26M are in boating.
They can both do a lot of things…and do them reasonably well.

Several years ago I saw read an article where someone rigged a 2500 Watt portable generator on the back of a clapped out early model EV that when new had about a 100 mile charge range or something like that. They drove it across the country… I believe from coast to coast or along those lines…

I don’t doubt that given the truck genre that this may have already occurred… a couple of times…

A coworker/friend, back in 2016 before I retired bought a Honda Hybrid sedan.
He is still driving that same vehicle with apparently the same battery pack I was recently told.
If true, That’s a long time for the battery pack, but I wouldn’t put it past him to see just how long he can make it last just to know.
Apparently he has only had the regularly scheduled maintenance done without any issues inbetween.
Last I heard he was well into the mid 100K mileage.
His daily commute was about 20 miles and he primarily charged it at work at the company’s free charging station. Seldom at home.
I contemplated getting one but my commutes averaged about 120 miles a day…. The battery ranges back then weren’t really up to that and back then the battery change-outs were expected every 3-to-5 years… they weren’t cheap either!
So it really wasn’t a good fix for my application at that time.

So while a hybrid has its limitations I believe it still has some really great advantages.

Back in the 80’s I had a peppy little VW Rabbit that was real fun to drive but back then I was in Texas and it was a long way between anywhere with a lot of lonesome space in-between. Not many 24 hr gas stations either back then in the lonesome sections.
I rigged up an auxiliary fuel tank in the spare tire well that expanded the fuel capacity by about 10 gallons which added a bit more than 50% more mileage range. It was covered by a 10 gage sealing cover plate and connected to the existing tank for fill and use.
I loved that when I filled up both tanks some of the gas station attendants wouldn’t believe the amount of fuel that Rabbit could swallow!

While legal in Texas it wasn’t going to be legal in California ( Note 1 ) (where I was moving to start the next phase of my adventures) so I easily removed it before moving there. (Professionally and personally Moving out of Texas after 12 years to California was one of the better things I’ve done! I never looked back. While we eventually moved East 20+ years later to New Hampshire and enjoyed the New England region there was a whole lot to like about the San Francisco Bay Area!… No snow shoveling was one of them! )

It was fun while it lasted…. I mention this as depending upon your current state DMV regulations you might want to consider the addition of an auxiliary fuel tank for your Volvo. Nowadays there is probably already a DOT approved one available. ( Note 2 ) Might be worth looking into…

Best Regards,
Over Easy



Note1: It's important to be aware that auxiliary fuel tanks are subject to California's anti-tampering laws, meaning that installation of aftermarket auxiliary fuel tanks on emission-controlled vehicles is prohibited unless they have been certified by the California Air Resources Board… a DIY tank obviously didn’t necessarily meet those requirements nor was it worth it to me to try and get it certified.

Note 2: Per Volvo… Volvo hybrid vehicles may include an auxiliary fuel tank, typically used to store an additional amount of fuel for extended driving range or to provide an alternative fuel source for the hybrid system. The auxiliary tank is designed to supplement the main fuel tank and provide a larger overall capacity. The auxiliary tank is typically designed to automatically transfer fuel to the main tank when it is needed. This can be achieved through a transfer pump or other mechanisms that automatically regulate the fuel flow. For example: The 2024 Volvo XC90 Recharge T8 Ultimate has a fuel tank capacity of 18.8 gallons, which is considered relatively large for a hybrid vehicle or something like this… direct from Volvo.