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Dimitri-2000X-Tampa wrote:

Sea Wind wrote:Dimitri,
Do you attach the tack line somewhere on deck or run it aft?
Pedro

Hey Pedro, I just use a quarter inch line attached to the extra hole in the forestay tang. I've thought about putting in a fancier set-up using a turning block but its never bubbled up the priority list. I suppose you can change the shape of it by shortening or lengthening the tack attachment length depending on how far downwind you are pointing, etc.

I attached a block to a short pendant at the stem fitting to get it above the furler, and led a 1/4" line back to the cockpit with a cleat on the SS rail. I'm not sure I'd have spent money for hardware, but I had all this stuff laying around anyway. Any fairleads don't really have to be blocks other than maybe the one at the stem fitting, and if I find a need to use the small blocks that I did use, I'll just source some cheap lifeline post fairleads. I only had to buy some black 1/4" line (all spin lines are black; others are different colors, since I'm easily confused ).

Sea Wind wrote:

Dimitri-2000X-Tampa wrote:

Sea Wind wrote:Dimitri,
Do you attach the tack line somewhere on deck or run it aft?
Pedro

Hey Pedro, I just use a quarter inch line attached to the extra hole in the forestay tang. I've thought about putting in a fancier set-up using a turning block but its never bubbled up the priority list. I suppose you can change the shape of it by shortening or lengthening the tack attachment length depending on how far downwind you are pointing, etc.

Got it. BTW, that is a great picture. Is that on the ocean side near Pelican Bay?

Thanks. It is on the Gulf Side of La Costa Island but it is further South than Pelican bay. You can see from this picture (click on it twice to get it bigger) the circumnavigation of Gasparilla and La Costa Islands my kids and I did back in March with my 26X and another family in a Sanibel 18. The picture is from where we stopped just south of a waypoint called "Mid Beach". That place is like a beach paradise so I highly recommend it!

tkanzler wrote: I attached a block to a short pendant at the stem fitting to get it above the furler, and led a 1/4" line back to the cockpit with a cleat on the SS rail. I'm not sure I'd have spent money for hardware, but I had all this stuff laying around anyway. Any fairleads don't really have to be blocks other than maybe the one at the stem fitting, and if I find a need to use the small blocks that I did use, I'll just source some cheap lifeline post fairleads. I only had to buy some black 1/4" line (all spin lines are black; others are different colors, since I'm easily confused ).

To be clear, I wasn't talking about the halyard as Pedro was asking where I attached the tack of the spinnaker at. I do have a block about 8 inches above the forestay mast attachment which has a halyard line which runs aft to the cockpit. That always has to be used to hoist or drop the spinnaker. I was saying that if I had an extra block and the time to rig it, I would put the tack line through there so I could raise the chute up higher when going further downwind versus pulling it closer to the deck when in more of a reach trim. I agree that it might not be worth buying anything for since I don't really fly the chute all that often anyway.its lucky if it gets pulled out once or twice a year.

Thanks. It is on the Gulf Side of La Costa Island but it is further South than Pelican bay. You can see from this picture (click on it twice to get it bigger) the circumnavigation of Gasparilla and La Costa Islands my kids and I did back in March with my 26X and another family in a Sanibel 18. The picture is from where we stopped just south of a waypoint called "Mid Beach". That place is like a beach paradise so I highly recommend it!

Great. We are planning to go to Florida the first week of March and Cayo Costa is at the top of our list, specially if the WCSS March trip is on that same weekend.

Dimitri-2000X-Tampa wrote:

tkanzler wrote: I attached a block to a short pendant at the stem fitting to get it above the furler, and led a 1/4" line back to the cockpit with a cleat on the SS rail. I'm not sure I'd have spent money for hardware, but I had all this stuff laying around anyway. Any fairleads don't really have to be blocks other than maybe the one at the stem fitting, and if I find a need to use the small blocks that I did use, I'll just source some cheap lifeline post fairleads. I only had to buy some black 1/4" line (all spin lines are black; others are different colors, since I'm easily confused ).

To be clear, I wasn't talking about the halyard as Pedro was asking where I attached the tack of the spinnaker at. I do have a block about 8 inches above the forestay mast attachment which has a halyard line which runs aft to the cockpit. That always has to be used to hoist or drop the spinnaker. I was saying that if I had an extra block and the time to rig it, I would put the tack line through there so I could raise the chute up higher when going further downwind versus pulling it closer to the deck when in more of a reach trim. I agree that it might not be worth buying anything for since I don't really fly the chute all that often anyway.its lucky if it gets pulled out once or twice a year.

That's what I was describing. I moved the forestay to the aft of the two holes in the stem fitting sticking out of the hull, and use the forward hole with a short pendant to a small block through which I have a tack line which is lead back to the cockpit. I'd post a pic, but I just buttoned the boat up yesterday.

The halyard I had added last year, about 18" above the forestay hound, to get the sail up and clear of the forestay. I can't reach that without going to the mast, but that's ok as long as I can douse from the forward hatch, and trim using the tack line in the cockpit.

Arrows at the left indicate small block to the port side of the stem fitting, in front of dock cleat, and attachment point at stem fitting. Arrows at the right point to the two blocks hanging off the lifeline stantion, one for the furler, the other for the tack line. The black line on the mast is the halyard. Some lines were removed for winter in this pic. The cleat is on the stantion at the start of the cockpit, where it's curved (no arrow).

Sea Wind, I think you will have a great time there it is one of our favorite destinations and I've been there twice a year for the last 3-4 years. In March, we made the trip along with the WCTSS gathering and there must have been more than 30 boats there. But currently, the club is petitioning the park rangers to allow campfires and anchors on the beach because they have been giving us a hard time lately, so I can't be sure the club will keep going there or find some place new. The event is usually in mid March but it hasn't been scheduled yet.

Tkanzler, that is a cool setup and what I was thinking of doing, do you find that you adjust the tack length very often? it sounds like you have your halyard block about 10 inches higher than mine. I don't have any issue clearing the furler when I keep the halyard tied to the bow pulpit, but I wonder if I might have had better spinnaker shape for reaching with the block being higher on the mast.

Caution note for those considering using the forestay deck-tang as a pin for an adjustable spinnaker tack-line:

This tang is not as strong as one would think. (on the model 'X" anyway) It's designed to mostly sustain vertical load from the head stay, not the side load that a spinnaker can put on it if you are beam or broad reaching and using an adjustable tack-line and the spinnaker goes well outboard which increases side load.

If you are are using this deck-tang as a tack-pin, consider using a set of parrel beads or an ATN tacker. This keeps the tack of the sail attached to the forestay, and the load is taken on the actual headstay and the tack line is then vertical.

This is from experience

So what happened, did the tang rip through the deck and cause your mast to come crashing down or something? If there is a backing plate and it is tightened down properly, I wouldn't think it would be weak on side loads and afterall, that tack line is pulling up as well as out. I have the same 2000 model X as you so now you have me a bit concerned

Dimitri-2000X-Tampa wrote:by Dimitri-2000X-Tampa » Tue Dec 18, 2012 4:48 am
So what happened, did the tang rip through the deck and cause your mast to come crashing down or something? If there is a backing plate and it is tightened down properly, I wouldn't think it would be weak on side loads and afterall, that tack line is pulling up as well as out. I have the same 2000 model X as you so now you have me a bit concerned

Hey Tampa,

No big accident like mast falling.

There is no backing plate on the 2000X forestay tang.
The tang goes though the deck and is bolted onto the starboard side of the hull.
That’s the bolt that you can see on the outside starboard side of the bow near the anchor locker drain hole.

The problem is that the tang bends and twists very easily above the deck under side load. I have a 150 genoa, and under full load never had any bending of the tang until I used the spinnaker with adjustable tack line.

This bending and twisting of the tang breaks the deck seal and allows water to come through the plate and onto the V-birth below.
I would assume that the bending and twisting could eventually cause stress cracks in the tang and may leed to a fallen mast situation.

So, if I understood your post - you are using parrel beads and a line through a block to adjust the tack? I don't have a spin yet, but am planning to add.

Chris

Well, my tang is a bit bent also (from the PO, not sure how he did it) so I guess I better check the seal as well as the bolt. It would seem that being bolted into the hull (like the chainplates are) would be a pretty strong connection.

If using parrel beads or an ATN Tacker, you're still putting side load into the stem fitting. It's just going through the forestay to get there, but the lateral load still has to be taken out via the stem fitting. It has no where else to go.

tkanzler wrote: If using parrel beads or an ATN Tacker, you're still putting side load into the stem fitting. It's just going through the forestay to get there, but the lateral load still has to be taken out via the stem fitting. It has no where else to go.

I believe the issue is when using an adjustable tack line. When letting out tack line, the tack of the sail falls to leeward and goes outboard. Using parrel beads (atn tacker) keeps the tack amidships.

I agree the load is still on the deck tang and masthead tang, but maybe it increases when outboard so it becomes more lateral stress on the deck tang. I am a Management Engineer not a Structural Engineer, so maybe a structural engineer can chime in and sort out the mathematical dynamic loads for us.

The forestay tang is made to deal with some side loading: All headsails produce side-loading on this tang. The amount of side-load doesn't change just because the tang is also under strain from the forestay (the side vector remains the same) but it may be that the tang mounting is not designed to withstand any side-loading unless it is under tension.

Because we don't have design specifications for this tang, the best bet is to listen to the experience of people on this board, and if they tell you that this tang can't handle a specific side load, I wouldn't fly that sail from it without installing a built-up fitting for it.

Don't think there would be any problem at all with the tang but I extended the anchor roller and mount the block for the spinnaker out the front of it which makes it much easier to use.