What's your tow rig?

A forum for discussing issues relating to trailers and towing MacGregor sailboats.
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Catigale
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Post by Catigale »

Im a Volvo and VW driving, NY Times reading, latte drinking liberal too Leon but on my good days I like to think I have the "Chip Hindes' call it as it is ..

Most liberals I know who have bought hybrids do it to feel good and be trendy - the actual impact of replacing a servicable car with a new one is a huge environmental one - this excerpt from the New Scientist raises some of the issues and attempts to quantify..
Energy and Forces Transport 29 03 2003 Older model Given the energy required to make a car starting from raw materials is greater than it consumes in fuel, is it better to run "old bangers" for longer, rather than buying new fuel-efficient cars?

I read it takes more energy to make a car--starting from raw materials --than it consumes in fuel in its lifetime. Is this true? If so, shouldn't governments or environmentalists urge us to run "old bangers" for longer, rather than buying new fuel-efficient cars?
Russell Viner Wokingham, Berkshire

The precise answer to this question will depend on the individual. Take the example of a person running a really old gas-guzzler who considers switching to a new fuel-efficient model. This person would "spend" the energy that went into making the new automobile and save the energy that would have been wasted on less fuel-efficient travel in the old vehicle. Whether or not there will be a net future saving depends on the amount of energy needed to make the new vehicle, the difference in fuel efficiency of the two vehicles and the lifetime mileage the new vehicle will do. Opinions on the likely answers to this question and some added complications follow
Ed

An article produced by the US Institute for Lifecycle Energy Analysis compared the energy and toxic substance balances over the 14-year life of a mid-sized car made in 1990. It reported that, of the total energy consumed by the vehicle, only 10 per cent was due to the manufacturing process, whereas 82 per cent came from direct fuel use or was related to the fuel extraction and distribution cycle. The remaining 8 per cent was energy used for vehicle servicing, replacement parts and insurance and financial services. Interestingly, the toxic releases are split about 50:50 between manufacture and use.

The vehicle averaged the equivalent of 9.2 kilometres per litre. Most European cars will do better than this, yet they might only average a 12-year lifespan. These effects together could take the ratio of toxic releases between manufacturing and use to nearer 30:70, but the total energy consumed by the vehicle would still be overwhelmingly down to use rather than manufacture.

The institute's article concludes that if you can replace your car with one that is more fuel efficient the chances are high that you will reduce your overall energy impact. However, if you are more worried about toxic releases than fuel use, you should keep your old banger going for as long as possible.
Stephen Godalming, Surrey, UK

It may take more energy to build a new car than to run an older one, but this is probably not the concern of environmentalists nor governments.

Newer cars cause less pollution, and have a lower rate of fuel consumption. Therefore a fleet of new cars will save fuel and produce less pollution than the same number of older cars.

Also, while governments are interested in reducing pollution, they are also concerned with the nation's economy. A large amount of income and employment comes from the automobile industry, so keeping it active is in the nation's interest.

Finally, it is worth pointing out that the energy expended in creating new cars may come from a clean or renewable power source, such as nuclear or hydroelectric.
Sam Hariry Slough, Berkshire, UK

Governments are working on this. There are luxury item taxes on expensive cars that take more energy to produce than they will consume in their lifetime. In the US, there are federal mandates and penalties for car manufacturers to ensure they meet fuel economy goals.

In Europe, some governments require car manufacturers to take their vehicles back at the end of their lives and recycle the vast majority of parts, a cradle-to-grave mentality that could keep 99 per cent of the vehicle out of the waste product cycle.

We could probably close every mine in existence today if only we had a much more efficient recycling system in place. It takes less energy to recycle than it does to extract virgin materials from the ground. The reason we don't is because most consumers have not been sufficiently educated to form recycling habits, and most manufacturers don't yet produce goods that can easily be recycled.
Axel Ohmstede Arlington, Texas, US

For one thing, the 14 year life estimated for a typical car in the US is probably overstated imho.
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kmclemore
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Post by kmclemore »

Wow. Who knew that collecting antique cars was envrionmentally responsible! :)

With nicely tuned 1949, 1967 and 1968 cars in my stable, and 1978 and 1998 sailboats as well, I guess I'm about the most environmentally correct guy I know! :D

All joking aside, though, I've always believed that 'resuse' is the most important of the tennants of environmentalisim. Our home is full of antiques and older things that have been re-built or restored to extend their service life. Frankly, I see it as a challenge to make the most out of those things that we have spent the energy to create, and throwing out a perfectly good piece of equipment only because one wants the 'latest technology' is painful to me.
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Catigale
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Post by Catigale »

I fixed a nice Braun 4 speed mixer which was stuck on one speed due to a failure of a $4 diode in the rectifier bridge...took me 2 hours to take it apart, solder the board, and put back together.

At $35 an hour, it just wouldnt pay to replace it, but everytime one of the girls stopped and gave me a hand, I realised I was passing on the torch of what my father taught him...

If they charged a lot more for these landfills we might think twice about both

1 Acquiring more crap so callously

2 Fixing the stuff we do have.
K9Kampers
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Post by K9Kampers »

Up until last night, our tow rig is/was an '01 Explorer. To avoid hitting a deer, the Admiral went into the ditch instead. She's OK, deer is OK, truck ain't OK. Wouldn't be suprised if it's a total, waiting on insurance adjuster. :|

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beene
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Post by beene »

Wow

Glad to hear the Admiral is OK


I always worry about hitting a deer while on my motorcycle, I think I would look worse than your exploder :wink:
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NiceAft
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Post by NiceAft »

K9,

Cost of truck......................$$$$
Value of unhurt admiral......Priceless


Ray
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Catigale
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Post by Catigale »

Replacing the truck much easier than replacing the Admiral, indeed. Its hard to not swerve when those deer or even pets jump out at you..on an icy road, thats basically toast for the car though.

Glad she is ok, K9..
K9Kampers
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Post by K9Kampers »

Thanks guys. It is indeed totaled. Now we'll be getting a new TV a year earlier.

Regarding deer in the road - over the years, I've managed to hit every one that jumped out in front of me (3). Minor or major damage & always able to drive away. At night - no time to swerve, just brake.
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NiceAft
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Post by NiceAft »

Depending on what you hit, I was always told if it's pot size :o , TAKE IT HOME WITH YOU! Hmm Hmm Good :)

Remember, if you hit a deer, do it at an angle so it lands on the hood of your car. You can just keep on going and not stop until you're at the kitchen. There are rules to go by though.
1. Freshness is always the rule
(if it's still there on your way home, it's too late).
2. Semi-squashed is much better than squashed; anything
clobbered by an 18-wheeler is absolutely undesirable.
3. Blacktop surfaces are much preferred over dirt
roads; concrete is a gourmet's delight.

Here is a recipe :)
NATHAN'S POSSUM A LA BOARD
Printed from COOKS.COM

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


1 lg. possum (no butter, it's greasy enough)
1 oak board
2 c. garlic (to kill smell)
3 c. onion (in case garlic doesn't work)
1 c. meat tenderizer (if he has dodged all those cars, he's a tough one)
10 c. bread crumbs (to catch all grease from possum)

Place oak board on table. Put bread crumbs on it and place possum in middle of bread crumbs. Do not preheat oven. You want to delay the smell as long as possible.
Cook 1 1/2 hours at 350 degrees - longer if extra large possum. Take out of oven. Place in zip-loc bag. Place in trash can and eat the oak board. It will be better than the possum.


Ray
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Catigale
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Post by Catigale »

Without subourning a perjury, if you hit a deer in NYS it goes under your comprehensive, not collision, insurance - which usually isnt surcharged for claims.

If Homer Simpson hits a deer, does he say DOH :!:

:wink:
K9Kampers
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Post by K9Kampers »

Tow vehicle update: We ended up buying an '04 Ford F150 XLT Supercab 4x4 5.4 Triton.

We were a bit apprehensive at first, and still a bit now, about having to buy a big truck for what will be a daily driver most of the time. However, the desire to have a safer, more powerful vehicle, than the Explorer, for towing the Mac, was the justification.

In our search, we test drove an '04 Dodge 1500 Quadcab, and really liked it - except that it felt almost TOO BIG! The admiral almost couldn't climb up into it with her bad back. The Ford is high like the Dodge but was easier for her to get into, plus she liked the seat comfort better. We will be getting step bars soon.

If I had a lot of "truck stuff" to do, I'd have looked closer at the Dodge, but for this vehicle, the mileage / $$ factors seemed to be the best value.
Frank C

Post by Frank C »

K9Kampers wrote: ... If I had a lot of "truck stuff" to do, I'd have looked closer at the Dodge, but for this vehicle, the mileage / $$ factors seemed to be the best value.
hmmm??? I doubt there's any "truck stuff" that Dodge would do any better than the Ford. OTOH, I doubt there's any mileage benefit whatsoever w/the Ford, so maybe "seating comfort" was your best criterion!
Just guessing that either pickup is good for ~11mpg in town, 14 on the highway, 11 towing ... YMMV :D



Edit: upon review of following post ... Duh~!!! ... my bad, wrong tack! :wink:
Last edited by Frank C on Tue Feb 13, 2007 1:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
K9Kampers
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Post by K9Kampers »

Good points Frank, but I'll clarify my wording.

For personal preference alone, I tend to favor Dodge over Ford, although I've owned equal of both. If my personal or work pursuits were to require a full size truck on a daily basis, I think I'd lean toward Dodge. I'm not saying Ford, or Chevy is less capable, it's just personal preference.

Mileage / $$ value was refering to buying a used vehicle. Dodge vs. Ford, same model year, same features, same price - the Dodge had twice as many miles on it as the Ford. We ended up with a 3 year old truck with 1 year of miles on it (25k miles).
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JJ
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Tow Vehicle

Post by JJ »

My father in-law was getting rid of his 1987 E-150 Club Wagon XLT. It has a 138" wheel base, 5.0 engine, and rated to tow 6,000 lbs. So, needless to say this is my winter project. Right now I'm tearing the engine apart and replacing all the gaskets, etc.

It's a full size van, and I figure I can tow the boat and haul the family around in the same vehicle. 8)
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Chip Hindes
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Post by Chip Hindes »

I haven't checked it regularly in a year or so, but last I did my '91 Expedition with 5.4 Triton got 13-14 in normal everyday driving, 17 on the highway when not towing, 11 towing the Mac.
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