On missing container ships

[Catigale]

Courtesy of the Canadian National Transportation Safety Board equivalent

Nasty story that cost two lives.

[They Theirs]

I recently watched a documentary about building one of the worlds largest container ships. The modern technology was way big, and the navigation experience very deep. Even then they were well aware of the potential for damage from lost containers and cargo floating just under the surface. You would think the double hull and sheer size of those ships would make them almost invincible. Not the case. Nice post. I remember my relatives in Washington State talking about their experience with Dead Head Logs, just under the surface, along with what ever else. We have a huge number of container ships in transit here and Ive always maintained watch to ward off debris or worse.

[Rolf]

Speaking of submerged hazards-- My friend had his prop ripped off/transmission ruined($25000!) after hitting a container ship dockline on the way to Catalina in his old Martinique. He waited 3 hours for sea tow with delerious seasick guests aboard.
Rolf

[KayakDan]

Lost containers are not all that uncommon. The pitch of a container ship in 35ft seas can often generate enough force to snap the cables holding the containers to the deck.
A few tidbits that I always found fascinating-the Abraham Lincoln9now renamed and sold) was until recently the largest container ship in the world. It could carry the entire contents of a 12 mile long freight train! The vessel ran between Japan and LA normally. Ships power was shut down to idle 5 miles out to sea-it takes that long to slow to approach speed!
And now they are even bigger!

[Night Sailor]

Insurers say a lot more accidents happen at sea because of crew failure than boat failure. Fatigue is by far the biggest factor. It negates experience, education, and common sense or logic.

We can learn much from perusing the cruise logs of vessels the world over via the www, reading official disaster reports and gleaning safety tips from other people's unfortunate choices in places like this:

http://www.cargolaw.com/presentations_casualties.html

I sure like my Mac's ability to enter shoal water out of the channel when things like ships or tugs with 30 barge strings are encountered in dicy situations. Of course, one has to be paying attention....

My old racing habit of glancing in the rear view mirror every few seconds translates on the water to turning around and scanning the horizon every minute or so for other craft. It's been important a couple of times, too, while sharing the same lake and marina with 100 mph boats whose operators seem to be inebriated part of the time.

be safe guys and gals. Don't let yourself get exhausted.

[ssichler]

I subscribe to the Capt. Ron school - "Don't worry he'll get out of the way."

Seriously those massive container ships are scary but I suppose it wouldn't matter if you got hit by a super sized one or small one.

As far as submerged objects go the forward scanning sonar they have looks very promising although too expensive now.

[k9piper]

Hi folks,
K9piper here. The posts on the missing container ships is right on the mark. Container ships are made to move cargo and do this by stacking containers one on top of the other starting in the holds and moving up deck. The boxes (containers ) are held in place by locking metal knuckles on the corners of the box on top to the bottem of the next box which is placed on top.
These nuckles are attached prior to the box being lifted onto the ship and stacked. The locking bar and the knuckle are placed on the bottem corners by a longshoremen then lifted. Once the stack is finished the lashers go on the ship and take ridged metal bars and attache them criss cross on one container to another going cfrom the bottom to the top when finshed. At sea sometimes the crew will tighten the lashing straps if needed.
The boxes are made out of steel and corragated to give strength as well as to make an air pocket so the box will somewhat float or bob if it falls from the stack into the sea. Sometimes the ship can hook it and bring it back onto the ship. Usually this fails and the box just rest under the serface or bob s. The insurance carrier of thebonded box will send someone to salvage.
These container ships loose boxes all the time, they even will sink and capsize REF the container ship at the Port of Albany Ny a few years ago that capsized.
The best advice for all is to :
1- know the shipping lanes for container ships and stay clear
2- give them the right of way if you are close and make sure you keep and eye on them and let them know you are in the area
3-when entering a port that has any form of container ship go slow and remain alert.
Now on the open road not on the water stay clear as they flip and loose the boxes on turns all the time. They are IMHO unsafe at sea and doubly unsafe on a chasis on the open road.
They were made to move a lot of freight quickly, consolidated and insurance company friendly.

Thus are the words of one dude from the DHS/CBP in the NY/NJ seaport.
Keep your eyes open and sail safe!

K9piper

[k9piper]

Hi folks,
K9piper here. The posts on the missing container ships is right on the mark. Container ships are made to move cargo and do this by stacking containers one on top of the other starting in the holds and moving up deck. The boxes (containers ) are held in place by locking metal knuckles on the corners of the box on top to the bottem of the next box which is placed on top.
These nuckles are attached prior to the box being lifted onto the ship and stacked. The locking bar and the knuckle are placed on the bottem corners by a longshoremen then lifted. Once the stack is finished the lashers go on the ship and take ridged metal bars and attache them criss cross on one container to another going cfrom the bottom to the top when finshed. At sea sometimes the crew will tighten the lashing straps if needed.
The boxes are made out of steel and corragated to give strength as well as to make an air pocket so the box will somewhat float or bob if it falls from the stack into the sea. Sometimes the ship can hook it and bring it back onto the ship. Usually this fails and the box just rest under the serface or bob s. The insurance carrier of thebonded box will send someone to salvage.
These container ships loose boxes all the time, they even will sink and capsize REF the container ship at the Port of Albany Ny a few years ago that capsized.
The best advice for all is to :
1- know the shipping lanes for container ships and stay clear
2- give them the right of way if you are close and make sure you keep and eye on them and let them know you are in the area
3-when entering a port that has any form of container ship go slow and remain alert.
Now on the open road not on the water stay clear as they flip and loose the boxes on turns all the time. They are IMHO unsafe at sea and doubly unsafe on a chasis on the open road.
They were made to move a lot of freight quickly, consolidated and insurance company friendly.

Thus are the words of one dude from the DHS/CBP in the NY/NJ seaport.
Keep your eyes open and sail safe!

K9piper

[Idle Time]

I must have missed something....I read the whole article and it looked like it was hit by the ship....the sailboat was seen from high above ( spectator on cliff) circling for about 15 min before being hit. And no one was spotted on deck.

[Night Sailor]

I saw a diagram once of how containers on deck are subject to forces in 12 different directions at once. Storms or rough seas make it just about impossilbe to keep everything together no matter how many chains or clamps are used.

[Rolf]

Those "knuckles" are called cones, and the lashing bars range from 10 feett (2 high) to 20 feet (2 high) and more. Besides the bread business, I'm a part time(casual) longshoreman here in LA/Long beach harbor, and have work to secure cargo with both. As strong as these lashing bars are (we attach them four per a single stack of containers, which may go six high above deck), it's the cones which do most of the work keeping the "cans" together. The sheer size and weight of these ships keeps thing pretty steady in rough seas, bad weather which of course is avoided thru state of the art electronics.

Rolf

[KayakDan]

Night Sailor,you didn't miss anything-this discussion just went off in a different dirrection about container ships. Clearly from the report everyone on the sailing vessel was "asleep at the switch" when they got hit by the container ship.
Man,I've seen some of those container ships in the Seaway. I wouldn't be able to sleep even if I wasn't on watch. I had a very close call while sea kayaking in Boston Harbor,and I can say from bad experience that large vessels move MUCH faster than is apparent.
I now carry a ferry schedule with me when sailing or kayaking in Boston or Bar Harbor ME.

[argonaut]

What I didn't catch was if there were attempts to hail the sailboat by radio. Wouldn't a container ship normally report a channel obstruction like a circling boat to the Canadian Coasties?
Those container ships are unbelievably fast, you can see their bow wave for miles. But they also have really loud signal horns. As they go through lake Ontario they signal periodically. Within a mile to a half mile the noise should from that should have been deafening even if they weren't answering the radio. But at 20 kts they don't stop on a dime. What determines safe spacing for these big ships?
Even in Canada I don't think you're allowed to just run over nonresponding traffic in a sealane. Sleep deprivation kills drivers and sailors I guess...

[Catigale]

From the report it is pretty clearly stated that the sailing vessel crew had fallen asleep and were circling in the channel

Whats scary is that the circling was interpreted on radar as tacking back and forth, so everything looked normal for the container ship proceeding in a channel.

Ive tacked many times near big vessels but never to cross their bows of course.

IN short, you cannot count on a container ship to avoid you as a safety measure....no matter how 'reasonable' this may seem.

[Red Coat]

You are correct that even in Canada you are not allowed to run over other vessels, but the fact is the St. Lawrence River like the Mississippi does not give large ships many options. In areas such as these there is seldom any wiggle room for a large ship, they stay in the traffic lane or they run aground and they do not stop on a dime.

Professional mariners have to take training and they have to be aware of whats going on around them, unlike most recreational boaters who are often drunk, asleep at the switch or just plain stupid! Incidents like this happen too often, and it is usually the fault of the recreational boater.

Unfortunately the media headlines never read 'stupid boaters killed because they they did not stay out of the way of a large ship" instead its always the other way round "Container ship runs over boaters"

Any idiot can buy a boat!