2004 26M repower from Johnson (Bombardier) 50hp to modern Suzuki 30hp

[Phill_Tijeras]

Hello all,

We have a 2004 26M with original 4-stroke Johnson (Bombardier) 50hp motor. The motor has been generally good to us but recently had some issues which were addressed but that made me wonder what our strategy will be when it's time to repower.. The boat is in the slip in So Cal and we go under sail as much as possible, however there are still times when we end up using the motor for extended durations (30mi-40mi runs) when we have to get back to home port relatively fast and the weather is not favorable to sailing. When we motor it is almost exclusively with full ballast and rudders down, so going hull speed. In fact there was only one instance since we bought the boat two years ago when we went on a plane for any amount of time - this was up in Salish Sea in BC where we had to make headway against a strong current thru narrows. So based on this use model, I was wondering if going to a modern 30hp motor would be an acceptable option.. I would of course prefer a 50hp but they have become so expensive lately and since we don't really plane the boat ever, I hope 30hp would do. Also, I do not want to go much smaller than 30hp to have some performance buffer when going against currents, big seas and the wind in a pinch.

Which brings be to the questions - any feedback would be greatly appreciated:

- anyone with 30hp on 26M or 26X, what are your impressions overall?
- with full ballast and 3 adults onboard, what throttle/RPM would 30hp run at when going 5-6kts in reasonable seas?
- will 30hp plane the boat at all?
- going from 2004 50hp Johnson to latest 30hp Suzuki, will the transom bolt pattern be different?
- would such repower be doable DYI by a reasonably handy non-mechanic or would I have to get it done professionally?

Thanks a lot in advance

[Starscream]

Personally I don't see a good argument for a 30HP motor.

To me, the motor has 2 main purposes on an X or an M: travelling at hull speed or travelling at a plane. Hull speed can probably be obtained with a 10 or at most a 15HP motor, and planing takes a 50 at a bare minimum (although it's not really planing) with a 60 or 70 being a better choice for high-speed motoring. In my opinion if you want to run on a real plane, you need a well-matched and well-propped 90HP.

Anthing that the motor can provide between 15 and 50 HP will never be used. A 30HP at wide-open throttle would just plow the boat into its own bow wave at maybe 10 to 12 knots, and waste a lot of fuel for no advantage.

I don't have direct experimental evidence of this, but I do have a lot of experience with the X and in talking to other owners.

[Phill_Tijeras]

Thank you for the comments!
I am sure a 15hp will push the Mac at hull speed..
My only argument against a minimal 10-15hp is whether it would have enough "longevity" to be used for hours on end - say 10 hours, to go against wind and seas and not think twice, when we absolutely need to.. Our 50hp is barely turning when going 5kts, I am afraid a 15hp will be running 2/3 throttle or smth when doing the same, and that just feels a bit much in the long term.

[Starscream]

Thank you for the comments!
I am sure a 15hp will push the Mac at hull speed..
My only argument against a minimal 10-15hp is whether it would have enough "longevity" to be used for hours on end - say 10 hours, to go against wind and seas and not think twice, when we absolutely need to.. Our 50hp is barely turning when going 5kts, I am afraid a 15hp will be running 2/3 throttle or smth when doing the same, and that just feels a bit much in the long term.

Well, that is the first good arguement for a 30HP that I have heard. It makes sense that a 30HP could do hull speed at a lower RPM and with lower noise than a 15HP.

I revise my position to say that I don't think there's any use for the top-end of a 30HP motor. There's no reason to ever run a 30HP at wide-open throttle, but I can see how it could be useful at hull speed to keep RPM and noise down.

[pitchpolehobie]

I have a 2002 26X with a tohatsu 25hp 4stroke which I think is the carbed down version of the 30hp. Tohatsu makes all of the 30HP engine blocks for all of the manufacturers. I predominately picked my boat originally for cabin space and cruising under sail (not high speed motoring). The 25 was in good shape and reported to be low hours compared to a 50 2 stroke on the other Mac i was considering Having said all that...

Without ballast in I get about 9.5knots wide open throttle.

Ballast in i get about 7.5kts WOT.

Just above neutral I get 4kts. This is my most used speed to get bsck to the marina after a good sail to make it home for dinner.

I like the 25hp as the fuel consumption is excellent and I am not typically in situations where I need or want to plane the boat. It is strong enough of an engine that if I did need to go upriver against a current it would make progress. I am not sure a 9.9 or 15 could do that well esp w wind.

The 25 seems to give plenty of low end Torque to move the boat on windy days in the marina and I can throttle up and down & reverse to make single handed docking managable in all but the heaviest conditions (25mph+ wind on the beam).

Ive considered swapping to a bigger motor but I keep talking myself out of it.

Curious to see how you proceed.

[Starscream]

I have a 2002 26X with a tohatsu 25hp 4stroke which I think is the carbed down version of the 30hp. Tohatsu makes all of the 30HP engine blocks for all of the manufacturers. I predominately picked my boat originally for cabin space and cruising under sail (not high speed motoring). The 25 was in good shape and reported to be low hours compared to a 50 2 stroke on the other Mac i was considering Having said all that...

Without ballast in I get about 9.5knots wide open throttle.

Ballast in i get about 7.5kts WOT.

Just above neutral I get 4kts. This is my most used speed to get bsck to the marina after a good sail to make it home for dinner.

I like the 25hp as the fuel consumption is excellent and I am not typically in situations where I need or want to plane the boat. It is strong enough of an engine that if I did need to go upriver against a current it would make progress. I am not sure a 9.9 or 15 could do that well esp w wind.

The 25 seems to give plenty of low end Torque to move the boat on windy days in the marina and I can throttle up and down & reverse to make single handed docking managable in all but the heaviest conditions (25mph+ wind on the beam).

Ive considered swapping to a bigger motor but I keep talking myself out of it.

Curious to see how you proceed.

Good info there. The hull speed of a 26X is about 6.8 knots, so that kind of confirms my suspicion that there's not much use in travelling at WOT with a 25/30HP motor. The boat would be climbing its own bow wave, using lots more fuel than at 6.8 knots, and probably being very squirrely, being caught in the difficult-to-steer-straight zone between hull speed and planing.

I'm sure the 30HP is very fuel efficient, but I wonder how much more economical a 30HP actually is at hull speed than a big motor; my 90 turns a 15" prop at just over 2k RPM to hit hull speed, and a 9 gal tank of fuel lasts forever at that rate. I've never been able to get a precise measurement of Gal/hr at particular RPM's, but my range at hull speed with 18 gal of gas is in the 300 mile range, quite possibly more. A 30HP must have to run at fairly high RPM to hit 6.8kn?

I had the new DF90 out yesterday afternoon and I tested the trolling mode. At the max trolling mode setting of 1,200 RPM, the boat moved at 4kn in calm water; I could barely hear the motor running over the cooling-water stream, and the fuel flow must have been next to nothing. I don't actually see much use for the trolling mode option other than possibly during long-distance motorsailing.

[Phill_Tijeras]

Thanks a lot for the comments! Sounds like we would do just fine with 30hp.. I just need to figure out if the bolt pattern will be different, I think this will determine whether when the time comes I'd have a go it it myself or get it done in a yard. I understand my Johnson 50hp likely uses "BIA standard" hole pattern that supposedly all modern outboard use, but not sure, I will have to measure it. Also not sure if 30hp and 50hp would use the same standard, my modern little Tohatsu we have on another boat clearly uses a different bolt/clamp pattern.

[dlandersson]

One of the guys up here (since moved to Florida) had an X with a Merc 30 HP engine. He was fine with it. It would get hm on plane if he needed to outrun some weather, about (12-13 knots) at 5500 rpm.

[NiceAft]

It would get hm on plane if he needed to outrun some weather, about (12-13 knots) at 5500 rpm.

Must have been no one on board, and an empty ballast.

[kurz]

One of the guys up here (since moved to Florida) had an X with a Merc 30 HP engine. He was fine with it. It would get hm on plane if he needed to outrun some weather, about (12-13 knots) at 5500 rpm.

No sail, closed eyes... With 50 HP he will get 30kn?

Forget it... Don't believe that...

[Phill_Tijeras]

Hello all,

Looking at my original post date - after exactly two years of soul searching we finally pulled the plug and ordered the new Suzuki 30hp motor to replace our ageing 50hp Johnson. While waiting for delivery I have been doing research on what prop I should use with the new motor..

The motor comes stock with 3-blade 9.25 x 10" prop, given the heft of our 26M and focus on maneuverability and punching thru waves and weather at hull speed, I wonder if I should line up a higher thrust prop, perhaps 4 x 10 x 7..? I would of course also ideally like not to overstress the motor neither by lugging it or by running at too high RPM..

In this context, would anyone running 25hp or 30hp motors on their 26M/X share what props you use and your recommendations?

Thanks a lot!

[kingtoros]

I looked at the month and day of your post and didn't notice the year until your last update

I had to do some intense searching to find my boats.net order for my prop in 2022. -- Caveat is that my motor is the Honda 50HP, 4 blade PROP, SS (11-3/4 X 11)

I don't have another prop to compare it to and was considering buying a 3 blade. This may be the source of my constant complaints for low top end speed.

That said, when maneuvering, I have zero problems. With practice, my 2005 does exactly what I want it to do and can thread a needle pretty accurately.
---
I wish you had gone the other way and bought a Yamaha 90HP that has the same weight as the Honda 50HP. I don't know anyone that has, (maybe one of our friends on the forum has) -- I've asked Santa for it for Christmas for a few years now, but I must have the wrong mailing address.

[Phill_Tijeras]

Thanks for the comments!
I too wish we could go for 90hp but Santa didn't come thru for us either
In fact I priced one size up motor - 40hp Suzuki and Tohatsu, both were $5k more, factoring in separate shift & throttle controls and dealer install.. So we gonna have to manage with 30hp

[NiceAft]

I've asked Santa for it for Christmas for a few years now, but I must have the wrong mailing address.

Toros,
Give up on Santa, ask Amy

[rsvpasap]

2002 26X. I ran a Suzuki DF60AV for about 5 years (1,900 hours) with a variety of auxiliaries, most recently a Suzuki DF6.

In late Autumn, 2024, I removed the 60 HP, upgraded to a panther four stroke auxiliary mount and now have a Suzuki 20 HP DF20ATL5, Suzuki 9.9 HP DF9.9BEL5 and occasionally use a Newport Vessels NT300 (allegedly) 3 HP equivalent electric motor for essentially silent motorsailing.

I have two 17 gallon aluminum gas tanks and a large electrical system, included two portable 50 AH 36V lifepo4 batteries for the electric motor because I use it primarily with the dinghy.

I'm in Puget Sound, San Juan Islands, Gulf Islands and cruise off and on year round. Despite the skepticism in some posts above, the 20hp WOT will move my heavy boat (5,500 lbs) at 11 knots in flat conditions with ballast in.

AI adamantly thinks I should switch to a four-blade prop, but I just have not done it yet. It's on the list.

My primary considerations for doing this:

1. Maximizing cruising range at 6.25 knots without refueling. Even with the 60hp, I spent more than 99% of the time at 6-7 knots

2. I'm often in places where there is no one around in the winter. I wanted outboards I can remove from the boat myself by hand and either repair or replace without taking the boat out of the water.

3. Experience has taught me to prioritize redundant systems. (I acknowledge I'm a "heavy user" of the boat.)

On the other hand, at 6.25 knots the 20 HP is not noticeably quieter than the 60 HP. But then the Suzuki DF60AV is renowned for its quiet running, that is one of its big selling points.

I wish I had done this years ago. On the other hand, if I had done this without first using a large modern outboard like the Suzuki DF60AV, I would have always asked "what if?"