whgoffrn wrote:BOAT after much thought I'd have to agree with you .... beefing up the rudder and then the bracket can be done and I may invest in a spare rudder and bracket anyway but you are right it will just move the point of failure to the other bracket bolted to the boat and rip it out of the hull unless a backing plate was put on....... the outboard is bolted through the transom and isn't going anywhere so yeah it definately is the strongest place..... any ideas on how to attach a rudder to an outboard ?????
Lot's of people do it - there are probably many ways to do it -
I think it needs to be quick and dirty easy peasy because your only going to attach it in a storm or after an emergency so you want to do it from the cockpit:
Outboard rudders are common in Europe and you can buy them from England or Scotland:
Hmmmm not sure it's feasible to bolt those on with large following seas and and following seas large enough to destroy the factory rudders or brackets would put that to the test as well if it had enough surface area to even steer with under storm conditions...... more food for thought anyway
JO wood works out of Texas says he can make solid mohaganny 1.5 inch rudders for our boat for $200 a piece if you send him the rudder you have to copy ... vice on the bracket and a backing plate on the inside may be another option
None of those outboard things shown would be strong enough.
In the Bahamas the worst case is 50 miles from land and thats like right in the middle of the Bahamas banks. You can just motor and be some place where you can effect temporary repairs. Most if the time you will only be a few miles from shelter.
The brackets are the weakest link followed the oem helm. Just have the brackets fabricated. Might cost 500 bucks but peace of mind might be worth it.
Brackets are the easy part a vice in the lower corner where the bend and mushroom out is the obvious weak point....just need a small round "lip" welded on .... the rudder i may just let this guy make me some mohaganny or white oak rudders if he can do it for $200
I'm not sure if all macgregor 26x have them or not but my transom has metal plate for added support I can just have extra plate to join the brackets to the engine mount plate for added support to take advantage of the outboard / transom strength so it doesn't twist out the "other bracket" that is bolted to the hull
Talking to Ida rudder just now he says there isn't much more strength for a 26x Ida rudder unfortunately over the oem one he said maybe slightly thicker layup so not worth investing 300 per rudder in
And lx ...im not sure what you mean by "do it from the inside "
Our rudders are hollow with stringers however most pics I've seen where they are broken are up where it's solid a few inches below the bolt hole and the obvious highest stress point where the rudder leaves the stainless bracket not down lower where it's hollow with stringers
I guess I could sand off some thickness to it up high to cut and add metal plating and throw a few bolts through it since I don't trust my own fiberglass skills (not that much) I've fiber glasses a few things but not sure I trust my skills with something as important as the rudders so I'd bolt them
Weak rudders will be a thing of the past.... problem solved ....found a guy who makes rudders in Texas who I'm mailing my rudders to and he's going to make replicas either out of white oak or mohaganny (I haven't decided yet) the stainless brackets will go get a "lip" welded into them so I can clamp vice grips on the lower end or a vice to strengthen those up and the grudgeons (bracket that bolts to the hull) I will have rebar tack welded from the inside of the bracket upper and lower with enough room to still pivot and welded to the transom plate my 50hp outboard sits on..... if all goes well this should bulletproof the entire rudder system still leaving the rudders as the weakest link but MUCH stronger overall and posing no danger to the hull .....pics will follow in the weeks ahead
BUT: As you can it stay mounted all the time and arrive in situations where you are worry about the normal rudders... Just take the rudders out of the water BEFORE they get damaged an sail with the ob/course keeper...
At the moment I will not try it as I have a hydrofoil - and like it...
Imagine how cheap you can go just take something that already is ready to go.
Oh meant beef up the hull from inside if need be.
The oem rudders seem reasonable though people have broke them by hitting the bottom with them. Has anyone had one break just under sail? The brackets at least on the M model are what really worry me. If you are going to have new rudders made consider a consensus of X model owners as to the wisdom of making the a bit larger. I think the M model could use to be a few inches wider.
kurz wrote:Maybe you should go with a course keeper system
Question is if it is strong inough...
BUT: As you can it stay mounted all the time and arrive in situations where you are worry about the normal rudders... Just take the rudders out of the water BEFORE they get damaged an sail with the ob/course keeper...
At the moment I will not try it as I have a hydrofoil - and like it...
Imagine how cheap you can go just take something that already is ready to go.
Yeah, I'm with kurz on this - it's only an emergency rudder or something to use in a really bad sea to prevent damage to the main rudders - this metal rudder attached to the outboard is not going to be a problem in a following sea and it's an easy fix - it can be attached as needed or left attached as kurz said - this is probably the best solution to the rudder issue - it's cheap, easy - just toss it in the boat and forget it - then when day comes that you really need something it's there.
Sumner broke a stainless bracket on his S (has a single rudder) crossing the Gulf Stream back to Florida from the Bahamas. The rudder bracket design is similar. It can happen.
You won't be attaching that outboard thing in any sea conditions at all. Do you mean install it before leaving port? Will the boat motor at higher speeds with it?
vizwhiz wrote:Sumner broke a stainless bracket on his S (has a single rudder) crossing the Gulf Stream back to Florida from the Bahamas. The rudder bracket design is similar. It can happen.
Just to clarify. It broke at the tail-end of the crossing back, but I think it had been cracked and failing over a period of time. I don't think that one minute it was fine and then just broke. Keep an eye on your brackets and pursue a course of action if you see one starting to fail. When I was repairing mine I noticed that it had also been repaired before on a crack in a different place. In hind sight I should of been more diligent in checking equipment before and during that trip.
