Replacing Mac Mast With Hobie 18 Mast - New To Sailing Need

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campbmic
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Replacing Mac Mast With Hobie 18 Mast - New To Sailing Need

Post by campbmic »

Hey everyone! I'm completely new to sailing and recently purchased my first sailboat a 1975 Venture of Newport.


Unfortunately I made a pretty dumb mistake and the mast ended up being snapped in half right at the spreaders. The mast is 28' long with a 3" x 4" base shaped like a tear drop (similar to the DM-6). The boom attaches about 2' 3" up the mast and the spreaders attach at about 10.5'. The spreaders are both 3' long.

After doing quite a bit of research I found that a Hobie 18' mast could be made to work for my boat. I found a Hobie 18xs mast locally a few days ago, and now need some help setting it up! Its about a foot longer than my old mast. The base is also 3" wide so it should fit into my tabernacle, however it is 5" long (1" longer than mine).

1. The slugs for the main sail and the slot they go in seem to be the same size.So that should work.

2. The new mast has spreaders at the same point, but they are too short. I see two options here.
First option: cut off the old spreaders, cut down the mast to 28', and then drill a new hole and attach my old spreaders onto the new mast.
Second option: Keep the mast its current height, cut off the spreaders that are on it now, and attach my old spreaders where the short spreaders were attached.
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3. The gap where the slugs insert the sail and the place where the boom attaches are different on my new mast. If I cut ~a foot off the bottom of the new sail it will move the boom attachment and slug entrance even lower. Can I just insert the slugs up the mast then attach the boom under it wherever I want? Presumably at the same location that it should be up the mast.
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4. I need to go back out to the marina and check where the shrouds attach vs where the stays attach. Here you can see where the either the shrouds or stays attached to my old mast (the two holes). Can I just drill the same two holes at the same height in the new mast to attach them? This hobie mast does have a "composite tip" and they would attach on the composite tip section.
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5.The rope for the main sail on the hobie mast seems to run on the inside and come out the top. Here are pictures of the two mast heads. What should I do? Try and repair mine and use it? Buy a new one? Or just keep the hobie mast head?



6. Lastly, my mast step is 3" wide which is the same as the new mast. However the old mast was 4" long and there is a screw that looks like it keeps the mast in place lengthwise in the step. What should I do?


Thanks so much for any help! Sorry if some of these questions are basic, but I am just getting into sailing!
campbmic
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Re: Replacing Mac Mast With Hobie 18 Mast - New To Sailing N

Post by campbmic »

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Seapup
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Re: Replacing Mac Mast With Hobie 18 Mast - New To Sailing N

Post by Seapup »

Welcome! I saw your post on another forum a bit ago and thought of posting over there but never registered there. I swapped my mast with a cat mast. The guy I bought mine from has a parts yard and we compared a bunch of masts to the original. I went with a nacra mast over a hobi 18 to avoid attaching stays to the comp tip. You may have already came across the thread in your search for a mast, but if not it has some pics/details of what I did. http://www.macgregorsailors.com/forum/v ... =8&t=18602 I am not all that familiar with the 23, but It sounds like your mast is the same 3x4x28 extrusion that was used on the 26S/D and my X.

2. The new mast has spreaders at the same point, but they are too short.
I didn't want to mess with the macgregor rig geometry since its much different than a cat, so I removed all the cat hardware and installed the macgregor hardware in the original macgregor locations. Most macs use large swept back spreaders vs short straight ones. (not sure about the 23 though)
Can I just insert the slugs up the mast then attach the boom under it wherever I want?
I think that is what i did. Mine stays in a marina so the sail stays on and the slugs cant fall out (free mast gate 8) ) Maybe look for a sliding gooseneck that will feed into the sail slot after the sail slugs are fed in. My potter 19 had one, it was convenient IMO. With the longer mast you could slide the boom up on light wind days or when not sailing to have more clearance underneath.

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This hobie mast does have a "composite tip" and they would attach on the composite tip section.
Maybe Matt will have advice here, he is using carbon for his mast project.
5.The rope for the main sail on the hobie mast seems to run on the inside and come out the top. Here are pictures of the two mast heads. What should I do? Try and repair mine and use it? Buy a new one? Or just keep the hobie mast head?


Either would work but the hobie setup is a little nicer IMO. I Kept the Nacra halyard masthead but went to line instead of cable to avoid the annoying cable clang.
6. Lastly, my mast step is 3" wide which is the same as the new mast. However the old mast was 4" long and there is a screw that looks like it keeps the mast in place lengthwise in the step. What should I do?
I am not sure about the "lenghtwise" bolt. It looks like your mast step base has only one hole in the middle then a tang of some sorts in front of it. I just let the extra 1" stick out the front of the mast step. Once the stays are all attached you should only need the one bolt through the base, the stays keep it in place.
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Re: Replacing Mac Mast With Hobie 18 Mast - New To Sailing N

Post by mastreb »

I think you should be able to drill the mast and attach the stays no problem. I can't visualize what you mean by "composite tip" however--The spreader tip is composite?
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Re: Replacing Mac Mast With Hobie 18 Mast - New To Sailing N

Post by Seapup »

The top half of a comptip mast is fiberglass (I was thinking it was carbon till I just googled it this morning.)
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Re: Replacing Mac Mast With Hobie 18 Mast - New To Sailing N

Post by mastreb »

Hmm. I don't have any experience with multi-part masts, but I would think you'd want the spreaders attached to the base section. Anyway, It's outside my realm of experience.
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Re: Replacing Mac Mast With Hobie 18 Mast - New To Sailing N

Post by Seapup »

Second option: Keep the mast its current height, cut off the spreaders that are on it now, and attach my old spreaders where the short spreaders were attached.
I would probably try and do something that keeps the hobie spreader attachment intact. Mac spreaders are just aluminum tube. Is there anyway to keep the hobie spreader assembly and attach longer aluminum tubes to it? The spreader attachment seems to always be where mac masts break.
campbmic
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Re: Replacing Mac Mast With Hobie 18 Mast - New To Sailing N

Post by campbmic »

I have visited your thread several times and that was actually the only resource I could find on the subject! However, unfortunately most of the pictures don't work anymore however. Our masts are the same size I tried to find a Narca locally, but didn't have any luck.

My mast broke at the spreaders (from hitting a power line) but the spreaders themselves weathered the storm. The spreaders attach to the sides of the mast and a bolt goes through the mast to connect the two spreaders to the mast. I was thinking it would be easier and less modification to just attach the old spreaders and keep the same rig geometry.

Spreaders-
What holds the most tension the where the shrouds attach at the spreaders or where they attach at the mast? Are they shrouds locked down at the spreaders or can they freely move through them? Any idea if fiberglass is stronger than aluminum? I'd like to attach the shrouds where they were on the old mast but this would mean attaching them just barely in the composite tip section. Could I the shrouds a foot lower without messing anything up? This would put them in the aluminum section.

Stays/masthead-
It looks like the back stay attached directly to the mast head. Also, my old mast head has a wheel in the front as well as a wheel in the back. The hobie mast only has one wheel. Could this have something to do with my two jib sails? Should I try and bend my old mast head back and use it? If not, how should I attach the back stay to the hobie mast?
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Re: Replacing Mac Mast With Hobie 18 Mast - New To Sailing N

Post by fishheadbarandgrill »

The fiberglass mast tip was a safety enhancement Hobie made years back to help prevent electrical shock mishaps.
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Re: Replacing Mac Mast With Hobie 18 Mast - New To Sailing N

Post by BOAT »

fishheadbarandgrill wrote:The fiberglass mast tip was a safety enhancement Hobie made years back to help prevent electrical shock mishaps.

Which is the number one cause of death on trailer-able sailboats - haunts every manufacturer.
campbmic
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Re: Replacing Mac Mast With Hobie 18 Mast - New To Sailing N

Post by campbmic »

Ok guys I went out and did a little more work on the mast. I cut off the spreaders on my new mast and attached my old ones and rigged them up. I also cut off the notches on the mast foot so it can fit into my step. I've attached the forestay to the new mast at the same height that it was, however this means that its now attached to the fiberglass portion of the mast, which I'm a little apprehensive about. I'm planning on attaching the boom just a few inches higher on the new mast, it doesn't look like it will be a problem.

The only two issues I've ran into is;
1. The aft stay attaches to the mast head. Since I'm using the hobie mast head, I'll have to figure out how to attach it.
2. The venture mast head had a pulley in front and a pulley in the back. The hobie mast head only has a pulley in the back. I haven't rigged my jib sails yet, does anyone know what the pulley in the front is for? Thanks!
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Re: Replacing Mac Mast With Hobie 18 Mast - New To Sailing N

Post by Seapup »

The only two issues I've ran into is;
1. The aft stay attaches to the mast head. Since I'm using the hobie mast head, I'll have to figure out how to attach it.
2. The venture mast head had a pulley in front and a pulley in the back. The hobie mast head only has a pulley in the back. I haven't rigged my jib sails yet, does anyone know what the pulley in the front is for? Thanks!
1. You will need some type of bracket. You can order them from BWY or make one. If I remember right the X basically uses two plates that bolt to the sides of the mast and come together to attach the rear stay. Looks similar to what is on top of your original mast, just two pieces contoured to come together though.

2. My guess is your original masthead had two blocks so the main halyard went up the back of the mast, over the top, and down the front...Then later to make things cheaper on the X they went to a single block on the side of the mast for the main halyard and two plates to attach the backstay.

From the pic it looks like both head sails are fractional, so they will attach down lower.
campbmic
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Re: Replacing Mac Mast With Hobie 18 Mast - New To Sailing N

Post by campbmic »

Thanks for the help everyone! I raised the new mast and have the shrouds and stays connected! Everything looks good, tomorrow I would like to run the rigging for the sails but am getting very confused. Any advice? Im particularly confused about the two job sails and how they're hooked up
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Re: Replacing Mac Mast With Hobie 18 Mast - New To Sailing N

Post by 81venture »

I'm a little late in this one but wonder if it ever worked out? I also have a VN23 and over the last year I have experimented with at least 3 different masts before settling on a 24' mast from an Oday 22...

I till have the original VN23 mast, I just don't use it...

how did your Hobie end up working out?

dave
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