New owner Qs

[Russ]

The doesn't have an aft stay because the side stays mount aft of the mast foot, providing both the required lateral and longitudinal stability. Our forestay (with furler) is a bit 'loose', but that's what you get with the design...I see no way of tensioning the forestay once the mast is up.

You tighten the forestay by adjusting the shrouds. My forestay also has an adjusting nut under the furler. I believe my furler is the one Macgregor manufactured. The forestay comes through it and there is a nut at the bottom that adjusts it.
The other model I've seen is the CDI furler and it seems to house a turnbuckle inside.


You are correct, however, it's not something you can do once the mast is up. To adjust forestay tension, you have to unpin the forestay to adjust it.

[yukonbob]

With the CDI FF2 standard on a lot of Mac's or so it seems, you can adjust when the mast is up. Make sure the turnbuckle has room to tighten before you raise the mast and pin the forestay. Once up pull the retaining pin that goes through the extrusion and lower assembly (doing all this off the top of my head) once the extrusion is free to slide up the forestay (about 12-16") you can access the turnbuckle and take up any additional slack (3-4" i think and assuming your turnbuckle isn't shortened to much already). Replace the extremely small cotter pin (very very important) let everything slide back into place and replace retaining pin, ring ding, and done. Takes about 5 min.

[Boblee]

There should be plenty of discussions on here about adjusting the mast and correct tensions and rake for both and
seems to me too that Toms boat has been modified AFAIK the has a backstay and there is no rope on the forestay especially with a furler.
BTW welcome to the forum Tom and hopefully the aussie section for those aussie peculiar enquiries.
Looking forward to seeing your photo's and the final result with this.

[seahouse]

For anyone not clear on this, when you have aft-swept spreaders (like the stock M), the turnbuckle on the forestay is only adjusted to set the mast rake, and not the forestay tension. So set the mast rake first, then set the tensioning of the side stays; although some back-and-forth fine tuning might be needed.

When the side stays are correctly tensioned the forestay tension will be as well. The relationship between them is dictated by the geometry of the rigging at the time of design and construction.

- Brian.

[yukonbob]

For anyone not clear on this, when you have aft-swept spreaders (like the stock M), the turnbuckle on the forestay is only adjusted to set the mast rake, and not the forestay tension. So set the mast rake first, then set the tensioning of the side stays; although some back-and-forth fine tuning might be needed.

When the side stays are correctly tensioned the forestay tension will be as well. The relationship between them is dictated by the geometry of the rigging at the time of design and construction.

- Brian.

Yes, but with the exception of the 3-4 inches in the turnbuckle.

[tom]

Right, my rig is defo no the usual

Here are some pics:
Foot of the mast -

Top of the mast -

where the furler connects to the mast -

Hope the pics work...as mentioned the furling wire is hooked up to a rope which runs inside the mast and out the bottom so not directly connected to the mast...also, my spreaders are swept aft and apparently (email from previous owner) there is a backstay....its combined with the outhaul? so both the outhaul and the backstay wires hook up to it...I could not find these wires (which run from port and starboard aft section of the boat) hence my wander...but awaiting further response on this...in any case it seems a very small diameter wire...thinking of upgrading all the rigging to 4 or 5mm...any views on that?

As to rest, well not really sure lol...

[Tomfoolery]

The first photo shows internal halyards entering the mast. There should be some turning blocks on the deck to bring the lines back to the cockpit.

The second photo shows the chicken head and backstay, which should terminate at the starboard side of the engine well.

Regarding the furler, it actually does look usual, just not usual for an . The white internal halyard hauls up the top bearing of the roller furler, with the sail in tow with it's luff in the slot. That's pretty standard, but definitely not like the unit supplied with Macs as an option. The halyard is guided below the forstay to hold some angle to the bearing - if it wasn't, the bearing might spin and wind up a bit. Also pretty typical. The black halyard is for the spinnaker, as far as I can tell. Hopefully you got an asymmetrical spinnaker to go with it.

The whole thing would be easier to visualize with the mast up, IMO.

[seahouse]

For anyone not clear on this, when you have aft-swept spreaders (like the stock M), the turnbuckle on the forestay is only adjusted to set the mast rake, and not the forestay tension. So set the mast rake first, then set the tensioning of the side stays; although some back-and-forth fine tuning might be needed.

When the side stays are correctly tensioned the forestay tension will be as well. The relationship between them is dictated by the geometry of the rigging at the time of design and construction.

- Brian.

Yes, but with the exception of the 3-4 inches in the turnbuckle.

Not sure what you mean by this, Bob. The turnbuckle is not included in the length of the forestay for some reason?
-B.

[Russ]

That's a nice mast. But nothing like I've ever seen on a Mac X.

I would presume someone replaced the mast with something from another boat.

Also agree, that mast up would be easier to see.

The backstay cannot be combined with the outhaul on any rig I've ever seen. Scary thought about running downwind without a backstay.

In this photo, what is that cable attached to? Appears to be a backstay.


--Russ

[tom]

The first photo shows internal halyards entering the mast. There should be some turning blocks on the deck to bring the lines back to the cockpit.

The second photo shows the chicken head and backstay, which should terminate at the starboard side of the engine well.

Regarding the furler, it actually does look usual, just not usual for an . The white internal halyard hauls up the top bearing of the roller furler, with the sail in tow with it's luff in the slot. That's pretty standard, but definitely not like the unit supplied with Macs as an option. The halyard is guided below the forstay to hold some angle to the bearing - if it wasn't, the bearing might spin and wind up a bit. Also pretty typical. The black halyard is for the spinnaker, as far as I can tell. Hopefully you got an asymmetrical spinnaker to go with it.

The whole thing would be easier to visualize with the mast up, IMO.

Cheers Tom, the first photo is actually the foot of the mast showing where the lines come out (and then they go into the block, into the organiser and to the cockpit )
The second photo is the backstay but the backstay stops at about boom height, so I figured the outhaul (I think thats it) attaches to it to keep the boom up (sorta like topping lift)...I was advised by previous owner that in the same connection, two backstay lines/wires are then connected to port and starboard aft (as opposed to one as per original design)...it seems I'm missing the two backstay wires so will need to remedy this

Re the furler...just to confirm the furling wire is the forestay on a Mac...correct? so there is no separate forestay to hold the mast?

I've received a picture of the mast up and rear config from previous owner so here it is

[tom]

In this photo, what is that cable attached to? Appears to be a backstay.


--Russ

Hi Russ, so yes that's the wire in question...its a backstay but its length only runs to just above boom...previous owner sent me a pic and shows that this wire is then connected to twin wires hooked to back of boat...but the outhaul is also connected to it...maybe i'm using wrong terminology but what I call the outhaul is the line that pulls the sail on the boom away from mast....and that line (which is very thin by the way) is hooked up to the backstay....

[Herschel]

Don't want to get too many "cooks in the kitchen" here, but I could not imagine an out haul being attached to the back stay. The out haul needs to go around a block at the end of the boom and back along the boom to a jam cleat on the underside of the boom. Otherwise the boom would not swing freely as you trim the sail for different points of sail. Nor could you trim the draft of the mainsail for light or heavy air.

[yukonbob]

For anyone not clear on this, when you have aft-swept spreaders (like the stock M), the turnbuckle on the forestay is only adjusted to set the mast rake, and not the forestay tension. So set the mast rake first, then set the tensioning of the side stays; although some back-and-forth fine tuning might be needed.

When the side stays are correctly tensioned the forestay tension will be as well. The relationship between them is dictated by the geometry of the rigging at the time of design and construction.

- Brian.

Yes, but with the exception of the 3-4 inches in the turnbuckle.

Not sure what you mean by this, Bob. The turnbuckle is not included in the length of the forestay for some reason?
-B.

You're right in that with proper rake the distance from the top of the forestay to the bow attachment is fixed, but why beat yourself up trying to stretch the braided steel forestay to connect it, when you have 3-4 inched of reserve in the turnbuckle. You can lengthen the forestay (so to speak) then take up the slack until correct tension is achieved. Not saying you should over tension it, but if there's an inch and a half slack to your FS then your rake is technically incorrect, not to mention possibly shock loading the rigging ect.

*mind you this is based on a setup with a CDI FF2 only as I mentioned earlier, where the actual forestay is about 18 inches short of the bow connection.

[seahouse]

You're right in that with proper rake the distance from the top of the forestay to the bow attachment is fixed, but why beat yourself up trying to stretch the braided steel forestay to connect it, when you have 3-4 inched of reserve in the turnbuckle. You can lengthen the forestay (so to speak) then take up the slack until correct tension is achieved. Not saying you should over tension it, but if there's an inch and a half slack to your FS then your rake is technically incorrect, not to mention possibly shock loading the rigging ect.

*mind you this is based on a setup with a CDI FF2 only as I mentioned earlier, where the actual forestay is about 18 inches short of the bow connection.

Now I see what you're referring to.

I leave my forestay turnbuckle (and all the others, for that matter) alone once its length (and tension) are properly set. Then I just use the tension from the mast raiser (which is pretty close to its limit at that time) to provide the tension and just enough clearance to insert the pin at the bow.

I would suppose you would want to count the number of turns of the turnbuckle, or mark the point, so you could return to the same point (and length and tension) each time. (And go through plenty of cotter pins if you are one who happens to trailer regularly).

-B.

[Russ]

Tom,
It would seem to me that a previous owner replaced the mast with another. It's not OEM.

So, I would assume its time to re-rig the mast. I would figure out how to get that mast close to original status. Maybe talked vantage of internal halyards while at it.

First thing I'd do is create a backstay before something bad happens.