Baystar Steering, will this work?

[MarkSouth]

Does everyone think its a good idea to change to hydraulic? Would it be better to just replace the cable steering with a new version of the same. How do I know what the model number is of the existing stuff?

[Catigale]

There have been <5 hydraulic steering conversions on and boats that I recall. Too expensive, too complicated, better options with mechanical replacement...

[MarkSouth]

Do you replace just the cable or everything? I have a 1997 26X. Is there a make and model that I can replace this with? I hate guessing on this stuff.

[Catigale]

I would track down the slop before I throw parts at it Mark...can you take a picture of your setup so we can try ID it for you...

I know about hating to guess too !!!

[windypatrick]

I'll chime in about my slop also, been too busy fixing things to address it yet...but it is coming up on the list. I can turn the wheel a huge amount before all of the slack in the system takes up, all of the monkeys stop with their motion and true motion ensues. In an aircraft this would not fly.

So a clinic on the bad spots to watch would be excellent! Best fixes, etc.

[MarkSouth]

If this was an airplane I wouldnt even start the engine! I am still thinking hydraulic is good but I havent quite got the parts list figured out.

[MarkSouth]

Here is a picture of my steering bars etc. Can anyone help me identify what cable steering replacement I would need, if I dont go hydraulic.

[Catigale]

Mark - take your steering bar off the mount, and see how much slop there is between the wheel and steering ram - this will tell you if hydraulic will help you or not....

[MarkSouth]

The steering cable moves in and out at least 1 inch before it stops when moving the rudder manual from the rudder side. So the slop seems to be in the cable.

The rudders are a little loose in the gudgeons but I would think they would have to be to go up and down.

[Catigale]

I want to work the other e NF...disconnect the steering arm , turn the wheel and see how much the wheel turns before the steering arm moves.....

[K9Kampers]

FWIW-
For the six years that I've had my boat, the steering wheel has always had 1" play both sides of center before affecting steerage. Disconnecting steering arm from tiller assm = same results. I've always accepted this for the boat and it hasn't given me an ounce of worry. YMMV....

[Catigale]

Exactly, Andrew. I'm not sure Mark even has a problem with his steering....TBD

[MarkSouth]

Well there is for sure a problem somewhere. The boat wonders under power or under sail enough where it feels like its out of control. The steering bar has a little slop but not much.

From the wheel side I can move the wheel 30 degrees each side of center before the steering cable moves. So something is wrong in the wheel part or the cable. Best I can see the cost to replace both of those is about 1.2 of the total of a hydraulic system.

[Crikey]

Hi Mark!
Sorry for the delay in responding to your PM (and hence, this post), I've been having a monstrous year so-far, trying to prep and sell our property for an eventual post retirement downsize.
For the long, and the short of it, my Baystar kluge was overall - successful, and cheap enough to avoid taking out a second mortgage (as some might imply). I have to thank Mastreb for the initial sale notification clincher, that got me going). Funny how we don't exactly apply the same cost/performance rules when considering the application of much more expensive powerplants to our hulls - but I suppose it's all relative to what we hope to end up with!

Having said that, I'm going to step back a little and give you a few negatives:
Just substituting a hydraulic for a purely mechanical set-up won't eliminate all the play you're commenting on. There are quite a few components in the lineup that will add up to a cumulative wheel turning before the rudders grab water, and eliminating these (which I haven't fully done yet) should be your first line of attack. On an M (mine) those would be:
Port and starboard link arm attachments.
Rudder hinge bolt spacing/tightness.
Rudder bracket hinges.
Helm attachment to link arm.
Helm.
If you search through the many posts, on this site, dealing with this subject, you will surely find that the primary culprit is the helm gearing slop, in most cases and as said, replacing that, or fixing it, is the cheaper option. I went hydraulic to cover two factors: Taking out at least fifty percent of the play (that belonged to the helm), and giving me an eventual avenue into a Raymarine X10 hydraulic auto-helm (apologies to Victor here!)
As for the remaining 'slop' it becomes somewhat of a quest for the Holy Grail. I haven't done it all yet, and what I've got left seems to bug me even more - but now at least I know where I need to go to finish with it.

I have to say that my approach is more suited to an M than an X because I didn't want to use the engine well, and separate the two systems from each other. You can definitely feel the difference in effort through hydraulic back pressure when both are connected together (Hence - multiple previous BWY disconnect postings also). I don't think you can do the same with your configuration....

One thing a mechanical steering system can do is provide a modicum of rudder feedback for that enjoyable helm 'feel'. Nothing like a tiller, mind you, but possible nonetheless. As I've indicated above, I'm an inveterate tinkerer, and may eventually try to remove the check valves from my Baystar helm to restore some of that. As it operates now (without powered autohelm) it's 'point, load and lock'.
I will be doing a MOD review sometime soon and spell out a few revised linkage tweaks and angle adjustments - but first 'The House!'.

Ross

[MarkSouth]

Thanks so much for all the info! Hope the downsizing goes well. I will be doing the same in the next few years and my wife is pushing to start early! ha!

The X seems to be enough different so that the way yours went in might not be exactly the same. I did talk to the people at Teleflex and they were most helpful. Also the people at foreandaftmarine.com are willing to swap out cylinders so I can use the base BayStar system and save a little on the cost. I wondering if I should mount the center mounted cylinder in the center of the engine area. I would just need to make a couple SS brackets. My only concern with this idea would be someone stepping on it it they are climbing over the back of the boat. In the picture below I would mount it on the left side of the picture. The other option is to use the splash well cylinder and then it would be off to the side. This might be the easiest and cleanest installation, but will cost about $150 more for the different cylinder.

Any thoughts?



I have been sailing since I was a little kid, so probably for 45 years. Been most of the way around the world in sailboats. Most of the bigger boats had hydraulic just because of their size. I havent been on a smaller boat until I got my X 8 months ago. After struggling with the dozen weekend outings I am ready to have a good time trying to sail it and not be fighting the helm continually! After my last outing last weekend I said thats enough. My arms and shoulder literally hurt from the work out! I am sure it was good for me somewhere, but I'd rather go to a gym if needed