FWD, mud, wind, 1st retrieval/trailer fun and games.

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133bhp
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FWD, mud, wind, 1st retrieval/trailer fun and games.

Post by 133bhp »

newbie etc etc

so, about 4 hrs later, finally managed to finally get the damm thing out of the water! The PO originally deposited in the river and parked the trailer for me in his 4wd. No such luxury for me!

First time for me and it had to be done as going on a trip with it soon. Sure enough the wind and rain started on cue!

First I have to negoiate a narrow S bend in reverse to get it out of the mooring. Wind blowing sidways I crab out just about avoid hitting anything with the bow, then motor down to this public slip right beside a busy pub - great! Frankly , I was more worried about the reversing around the tight pub car park with the trailer trying to look like I knew what I was doing, more than anything else, but to my surprise, I somehow holed it on one! The ramp was now wet and looking very steep though and I knew I'd be lucky to get it out with my car.

Wind was all over the place too but after 3 tries with bow going off across the the trailer at the last 5 feet, finally to managed to get it in very roughly enough to attach the winch strap (twin spped heavy duty I just bought as thought would need it) In retrospect, although CB was down a little and ballast in, I should have left the one rudder down till right on the trailer, as didnt stay pointed even with wind without a rudder.

I got the trailer in deeper than the photo shows but the front bunk was proud still (the drop off prevented going deeper) and this was the big problem. the bow was caught under it, the winch just pulling aginst it. Somehow I got it over the bunk, more a result of the heavy duty winch than anything

Anyway, incrediably I actually made it about 4 feet up the ramp till hit a muddy patch and then it just spun. As was getting dark, out came the tow rope on to my partners mini - and with a gentle pull it went up very easily. If the ramp were dry, even with grass, my car would have pulled it out no problem. If I had not tried to be clever and gone really slowly, I may have done it as is?

Once on though, did the mac bump twice, strapped down and it towed very well. (2.0 diesel auto) Whole thing was Stressy first time, but could have been a lot worse and relieved its done. This forum has been a great help.

Cheers.



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133bhp
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Re: FWD, mud, wind, 1st retrieval/trailer fun and games.

Post by 133bhp »

Last edited by 133bhp on Mon Apr 09, 2012 8:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Tomfoolery
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Re: FWD, mud, wind, 1st retrieval/trailer fun and games.

Post by Tomfoolery »

I leave one rudder down, but not restrained, when lining up to the trailer. The swing centerboard I keep about half-way down, and pull it up at the last second. It comes up easily, and wouldn't hurt anything if I wasn't fast enough, but I pull it up anyway. Only takes one hand.

You might want to extend the goal posts upward a bit. Most folks use PVC pipe, so the gnarley paint doesn't scratch the hull. Additional goal posts and/or rope or cable to the winch support will help you keep it straight in a current or wind.

You mentioned the boat had ballast in - consider pulling the drain and vent, and giving it a little time to drain out before pulling up the hill completely. It holds something approaching 1400 lb [640 kg] of water, and letting it drain while you winch it up makes it easier to winch up. Or run the boat around at 7+ knots to drain the ballast first, making it even easier. Most of the water line depth increase with ballast vs empty tank is in the bow (on an :macx:, at least), so it can only help to let it drain before or while you're putting it on the trailer, especially if you're having issues with the v-bunk at the bow. Use some lube on the bunk carpet - the stuff I use is amazing, though I can't recall off hand what it is.

2.0L diesel auto? Long, skinny license plates? No steering wheel on the left in the pics? Pub? Doesn't sound like the US to me. :D You might want to put at least a generic location in your info. Mac owners are all over the planet, and you might be surprised to find others close to you. 8)
Kittiwake
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Re: FWD, mud, wind, 1st retrieval/trailer fun and games.

Post by Kittiwake »

133bhp wrote: .... did the mac bump twice, strapped down and it towed very well. (2.0 diesel auto) Whole thing was Stressy first time, but could have been a lot worse and relieved its done. ....
Sounds pretty good to me for a 1st retrieval.
You may have broken with a trailer-sailor tradition though: at least for the 1st time around one is supposed to indulge in a certain amount of whining and cursing, and some audible grumbling at one's partner. With regard to the latter, I now find it is better to send my wife off to enjoy the scenery while I launch/retrieve. :)
On a serious note, don't forget that sometimes it can be more peaceful to leave the mast at home - especially if the plan is just to poke along the canals for an afternoon. I use 2 stepladders to single-handedly remove the mast and lay it on blocks.
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133bhp
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Re: FWD, mud, wind, 1st retrieval/trailer fun and games.

Post by 133bhp »

:) Oh yes, plenty off ranting! even though I promised my g/f I would'nt no matter what. Good to know its "normal"! On the vid I'm making excuses for myself for the wind. (havent even raised the mast yet, should be a laugh)

Yep, all good ideas. I could really see the use of bigger goalposts and some rope. thats on the to do list. I'd walk it in in at all possible. I did open the valve as I went on at an angle, and waited 5/10mins. though was in so deep, hard to know if draining stiill? I have a plan to use the old winch on the backside of the ladder post, to angle down to pull the bow up as I pull on the other one along. Probabaly get in even deeper is the answer though.


I'm in the UK. Cambs area. cheers
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Dido
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Re: FWD, mud, wind, 1st retrieval/trailer fun and games.

Post by Dido »

Looked good on the video, it gets easier with more atempts.

Can recommend letting some ballast out as well, easier to get it up on the front bunk 1st time and not need the mac bump !

Were in P'boro on the Nene in winter and Wells next the sea in summer with the odd trip to the Broads and France thrown in for good luck, the boat looks familiar, where did the PO keeper her ?
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Re: FWD, mud, wind, 1st retrieval/trailer fun and games.

Post by Russ »

Watching the vid, I'd say you did pretty good. Very good actually considering no fins down.

These boats are horrible with fins up. Steering is very poor. I would put the rudders down and untied and let them kick up if/when they hit. Then pull them up once on the trailer. Centerboard, same thing. I pull mine up just before hitting the trailer.

Slippery ramp with little car, not a good idea. Seems like you found a good solution with the tow car.

Nice to have a pub next to the ramp. My guess is the ramp is the entertainment for the patrons. I hate having an audience.
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Re: FWD, mud, wind, 1st retrieval/trailer fun and games.

Post by Kittiwake »

RussMT wrote:Watching the vid, I'd say you did pretty good. Very good actually considering no fins down.
These boats are horrible with fins up. Steering is very poor. I would put the rudders down and untied and let them kick up if/when they hit. Then pull them up once on the trailer. Centerboard, same thing. I pull mine up just before hitting the trailer.
.....
I know this ("fins up = poor steering") has been mentioned on this board; but I think it is overemphasized. I have taken to leaving both rudders (along with mast) at home on gunkholing trips that involve a lot of trailering. The resultant clear decks and stern (and reduced fiddling with stuff!) are a pleasure; and one gets used to the steering and allowing for wind/tide. I do like the ballast for rough water; but this summer I will experiment with leaving the daggerboard at home too as I usually keep it retracted if I am not sailing.
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133bhp
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Re: FWD, mud, wind, 1st retrieval/trailer fun and games.

Post by 133bhp »

thanks for postive comment. that vid went wrong just after she put the camera down though :)

It seemed slow to turn/slide with no rudder but I'm not sure?, I was winging it anyway. ( in the vid I was late to turn as I ws pulling the rudder up) Problem was right at the trailer, the bow turned left/right. I dont know why there? maybe the wind thorugh the trees or something? but seemd to swivel without doing anything? I need to practise in the same conditions,

No sails on yet, another time. But rhe mast looked decidely bent (arced backwards) The shroud wires were very tight, so I loosed one notch. Now both are medium tight to little loose, but the mast "seemes" a it straighter. I had to depart at that point but would overtightening the shrounds bend the mast back? The forestay/backstay were not overly tight?

will post a photo later.
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Re: FWD, mud, wind, 1st retrieval/trailer fun and games.

Post by Sea Wind »

That was a pretty good retrieval. As others have mentioned, I also keep one rudder down and the centerboard about a foot down. If the ramp does not have a docking wall, I also run a line from the bow cleat and run it aft on the outside so that it is always ready to be thrown forward and then secured to the trailer before connecting the winch strap.

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Re: FWD, mud, wind, 1st retrieval/trailer fun and games.

Post by 133bhp »

edit last post, meant to say I got the mast up today but no sails etc.

I had a bow line to the cockpit but between aiming for the trailer, lifting the rudder/CBm valve and generally stressing in front of the pub mob, it was never going to happen! forgot the centre board anyway :)

Dido - regards PO? - he had it at brightlingsea I beleive? I have just given the enviroment agency £400 quid ($700) for the privelge of using the Nene/anglain waterways. We are off next week to the broads, (another 50 odd) partly as a good place to learn to sail in gentler waters. Although am aiming to take to the coast via yarmouth depending on weather/how it goes? (If not back in two weeks, call the police!) Anuway, likewise Britanny is the ultimate goal in sept. Have you some posts regarding your trips you can point me too?

thanks all
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Re: FWD, mud, wind, 1st retrieval/trailer fun and games.

Post by kitcat »

Nice write up and vid. I wondered if it was somewhere near the Fens? It's never easy to get the boat back on the trailer on a river, especially when it's windy too, well done on your first attempt. I launch and retrieve on the River Tamar, just north of Plymouth, and that's got a pretty strong tidal flow, so understand the problems. I have tended to use a bit more speed when getting onto the trailer, with the use of extended goalposts, for ease of getting it in the middle. Last time on, at the end of last season, I probably used a few too many revs, and arrived at the snubber a little quicker than anticipated, but no damage done. [phew!]

Keep up the reports, most interesting.

Paul.
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Re: FWD, mud, wind, 1st retrieval/trailer fun and games.

Post by Kittiwake »

133bhp wrote: .... It seemed slow to turn/slide with no rudder but I'm not sure?, I was winging it anyway. ( in the vid I was late to turn as I ws pulling the rudder up) Problem was right at the trailer, the bow turned left/right. I dont know why there? maybe the wind thorugh the trees or something? but seemd to swivel without doing anything? I need to practise in the same conditions,

No sails on yet, another time. But rhe mast looked decidely bent (arced backwards) The shroud wires were very tight, so I loosed one notch. Now both are medium tight to little loose, but the mast "seemes" a it straighter. I had to depart at that point but would overtightening the shrounds bend the mast back? The forestay/backstay were not overly tight?
One thing to keep in mind is "prop(eller) walk": this was mentioned by aya16, seahouse, Crikey, and me in a recent thread, Re: BWY Steering Quick Disconnect. It became a bit confusing because a reader ends up not being sure whether the writer is talking about direction of turning of the bow or the stern. But theoretically a boat with a right-handed (which is standard) prop will have a tendency for the stern to move to starboard when in forward gear, and an even greater tendency for the stern to move to port when in reverse (ie. as if the prop were walking across the bottom of the lake). So theoretically during low speed manoeuvers one should keep this in mind and especially in reverse.
Quoting Wikipedia: Propeller walk is the term for a propeller's tendency to rotate a boat as well as accelerating it forwards or backwards.
A right-handed propeller (which rotates clockwise [as viewed from the stern] when in forward gear) will tend to push the stern of the boat to starboard. When in reverse gear, the effect will be much greater and opposite. A right-handed propeller will now push the aft of the boat to port.


But as you suggest and kitcat states, the Mac, with its high freeboard and low mass, is very subject to local breezes ... and currents at a ramp can be a real challenge.

Secondly, although many on this bulletin board know better than I ever will, I believe over-tensioning the shrouds on a Mac X can bend the mast backward because the chainplates are aft of the mast foot - indeed this is sometimes done deliberately (perhaps at risk of your mast). I would save that trick until I was very comfortable with the basics.

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133bhp
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Re: FWD, mud, wind, 1st retrieval/trailer fun and games.

Post by 133bhp »

Here's a photo before loosening a hole, will take another when back there.

... yes, I guess being rearwards it loads the mast, I am surprised that at that shallow angle it can exert that much force to bend the mast though!

Glad I'm entertatining Kiitiwake! the reason I posted up in the first place is to me, its reading about the the cock ups, hassles etc that I found useful/heartening. When all goes wroong, its nice to know your in good company :)

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Re: FWD, mud, wind, 1st retrieval/trailer fun and games.

Post by Russ »

I have no idea what you just said. But your boat looks great and the sky is blue. That's gotta be a good thing.
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