Question about flushing

[joesonio]

According to the owner's manual ( Suzuki D70), there are two ways to flush the outboard, with the engine running or not. It does say that flushing while running the engine is the preferred method. However, I have my boat moored in a saltwater slip so I'm not sure if I can flush with earmuffs in the water. The second method is of course by using the secondary flush port which you can do with the engine in the vertical or tilted position. It seems so much more practical to flush without the engine running, but is the flush adequate without running it. Any recs?

[Divecoz]

Hi Joe .. I assume your 2nd choice is a Hose bib.. / fitting.. Just like her sister Mercury.. That hose connection is set to OPEN the thermostat under pressure NOT temp.. it will force water through out the entire cooing system ( Someone will correct me if I am wrong) IF you just force water through that system COULD you damage the impeller on the water pump?? I suggest you raise the motor hook up the hose and the run the motor with the hose running..
Watch the tell tale ...If you dislodge Gunk.. it might plug the tell tale.. But as long as water is rushing out.... the Prop shroud all is still OK.. However , you should dislodge whatever hinders the tell tale flow .. All is a matter of... IMHO.. and I graciously accept correction by those more knowledgeable.. not so much by those talking out their hats hahaha.. wink wink nudge nudge

[Octaman]

NEVER run your motor when in the all up position. (Sorry Divecoz)

The angle is too steep and you run a serious risk (if not the certainty) of destroying your motor due to lack of internal lubrication.
I think your Manual, Joe, clearly says you should NOT.

Every marine motor is designed to work at angles and not just in a horizontal position due to the nature of the working environment. However, there are limits. These angle limits can be different from one motor to another.

I remember my concern in the first days of our MacM wondering if in the case of motor sailing with just the main up and with an excessive amount of heel, if the outboard would not dry up of lubricating oil. After researching, it turned out that the ‘carter’ of the outboard is suitably designed, with a shape resembling an inverted cone with the end of the oil pump intake all the way at the bottom (narrow end) thus allowing for large angles of heel during operation. The pitching and rolling angles should be specified in one of the factory manuals (not the ones we get as users). I could not get my hands on one. Let me know if you do, Joe – it would be interesting to read the angle values.

Coming back to your DF70 (it is a D’F’ right ?) your only ‘flush’ choice whilst in the water is to turn OFF the engine, raise all the way up and flush with a hose connected to the side access/connecting point that is there specifically for this purpose, as the Manual clearly describes.

You want the engine all the way up because otherwise the bottom unit would remain in the water and you would not be flushing the impeller in the process which is very important as well.
The only drawback I see with flushing this way is that when you are done, a certain amount of water remains inside the engine head and cooling passages. If you were flushing this way on land, you could just lower the engine again after finishing and actually see the remaining water drain out.
If you are storing long term it is better to have a dry motor than a motor with water trapped in it even if clean water.
However, if the boat is in the water anyway, it probably means that you will be using the motor again sooner or later. So, this should not be a problem. I would just insist on flushing a little longer with this method and getting all the salt out (assuming you are in sea water) so that what stays in the motor at the end of the flushing process is clean water with no concentration of salt.

Taking this a little further; A practical way to determine how much pitch your motor can take without running dry of lubrication is to note the tilt angle when you tilt up with the boat in the water and the engine running - You know very well that there comes a point when the lower unit is not low enough in the water to suck in water for cooling of the engine. That is when the water stops coming out of the bleed hole. As a rule of thumb, I would not operate the engine beyond this angle even if do provide for external cooling.

Hope this helps.

Octaman

[Divecoz]

Thank You Octaman.. Better safe than sorry.. I guess Joe.. Ya need to pull the boat out of the water?? I did think about the Gear case Octa and its fine to run in that position , but I NEVER....thought to much about the Block lubrication../ sump..Yea dont risk it..

[Crikey]

Remember, if you've had a heavy day on the water ..... FLUSH TWICE

[pokerrick1]

Once again a vote for Evinrude E-TECS. My 60HP said it DIDN'T HAVE TO BE FLUSHED - - -but to accomodate those of us who would flush anywway - - - it had connections for a hose built in - - - and I added a quick connect so I could flush easily and quickly about once a month - - - and I pressure flushed with the engine in the up position Hooray E-TECS

Rick

[Divecoz]

Rick your among my favorite posters / members.. BUT when you flushed? Was it pushing against a Impeller? The sump issue ( for running engines) I am not sure of, not on an Outboard ... Cars, seem to have no issues being at some severe degrees going up very steep hills.. Flush? Don't Flush? What are we flushing? I assume no less than Marine Growth / Flora.. Maybe salt build up upon evaporation.?? I do it on the trailer with the engine running the gas out..

Once again a vote for Evinrude E-TECS. My 60HP said it DIDN'T HAVE TO BE FLUSHED - - -but to accomodate those of us who would flush anywway - - - it had connections for a hose built in - - - and I added a quick connect so I could flush easily and quickly about once a month - - - and I pressure flushed with the engine in the up position Hooray E-TECS

Rick

[Russ]

Once again a vote for Evinrude E-TECS. My 60HP said it DIDN'T HAVE TO BE FLUSHED - - -but to accomodate those of us who would flush anywway - - - it had connections for a hose built in - - - and I added a quick connect so I could flush easily and quickly about once a month - - - and I pressure flushed with the engine in the up position Hooray E-TECS

Rick

The Suzi has a standard hose fitting to flush with a garden hose as well. The concern mentioned above is valid.

What is the purpose of flushing? Salt build up? I flush the junk out at the end of the season. Get rid of bio stuffs growing in there. A motor dunked in the water is gonna be full of junk after a while.

[pokerrick1]

I'll probably never have an outboard again so I won't have to worry

Rick

PS Two big Cats in my next boat - - - I hope

[seahouse]

Hey Divecoz et al !

Cars under severe G-forces can have an issue. Because of the shape and design of the oil pan, fore and aft (accelerate, decelerate), as you pointed out, there is usually sufficient oil retained within the pan that air does not get drawn into the sump. But cars pulling high-G turns for long enough with a conventional lubrication system will push the oil sideways in the pan, draw air and destroy the engine. Happened more frequently with less-modern engines. So race cars, which pull high-G turns regularly, are dry sump for this reason, which is not unlike the dry sump E-tec configuration.

You don’t have to run the gas out with the E-tec, with the exception of the small amount of fuel remaining in the fuel line outside the engine to the tank, which you can easily gravity-drain back into the tank if you like. Unlike conventional carbureted engines, the fuel inside the E-tec is pressurized and completely sealed within an oxygen-impermeable system. Any fuel degradation that occurs over a storage period is therefore negligible.

Rick, I think your flushing practice is good preventive maintenance. It can’t hurt to flush the engine out with clean, fresh water under pressure every now and again. It will remove any loose sediment and debris that might not be removed under normal operating conditions, and will allow the engine to more efficiently cool itself, both in the long and short term.

Warning, though. Some engines (PWC’s, and maybe some others, but not E-tecs) will certainly be destroyed by hydrolocking if you turn the pressurized water on before starting the engine to flush it. The engine must be already running and pumping exhaust or water can be pushed back up through the exhaust water jacket and into the cylinder (in this case, the two are not separate, they are connected, both for cooling and sound attenuation).

It takes a surprisingly small amount of water to do so. Using a car as an example, a 4 litre V8 engine at 10:1 compression ratio will be hydrolocked (FUBAR) with just 50 ml of water.

-Brian.

[c130king]

...However, I have my boat moored in a saltwater slip so I'm not sure if I can flush with earmuffs in the water. Any recs?

When I kept my boat in a slip for a short time I did the flush with the ear muffs on the water. Boat was backed in and I was able to get the motor right up next to the dock. Was able to slip on the muffs with out too much difficulty. Turn on the water. Turn on the motor. Vioila...

Good Luck.

Cheers,
Jim

[Highlander]

Nice glass of warm water & two large spoonfulls of epsom salts & ya will be well flushed

J