Why do some say the M sails better than the X?

Dangerdog · Post by **Dangerdog** » Sat Apr 30, 2011 6:00 am

Any particular reason? I tried searching this issue, couldnt find anything solid. Seems to me i can find X's (on average) at a lower price than the M.

Just curious what the differences are.

If there is a thread on this kindly point me to it.

thanks for any help, Jake

Ixneigh · Post by **Ixneigh** » Sat Apr 30, 2011 7:09 am

For starters. The M has a rotating mast that makes a huge difference. It pulls the boat more forward instead of more to the side. It also has a taller mast.
The hull is much different. It has a daggerboard instead of a centerboard.
If sailing is your thing get the M.
Ive sailed on both. My M is faster under sail then my friends X

Ixneigh

Ps this is not to imply that the X cant sail. It sails fine, just slower.
Maybe using a salvaged mast from a damaged M might make the X faster.

What i like about my boat is its ability to sail with no board down at all in very shallow waters. This is extremely important for my application.I dont know if the X can do that, probably not, as i believe it is due in part to the efficiency of the rotating mast.

rwmiller56 · Post by **rwmiller56** » Sat Apr 30, 2011 7:38 am

The

is also supposed to have a hull design which is more favorable for sailing, as compared to motoring.

beene · Post by **beene** » Sat Apr 30, 2011 7:43 am

On average:

- the X is less expensive than the M as the M is newer, like since 2002 or so
- the X is a better power boat than the M
- the M is a better sailboat then the X
- white hulls are faster
- blue hulls are sexy

The author claims no responsibility for the above statements.

Opinions may vary
Personal experiences may prove to have varying results

Now..... I am going to run and hide.

G

uanhanlouee · Post by **uanhanlouee** » Sat Apr 30, 2011 9:24 am

It is an interesting fiction.

I would disagree that the M sails faster. The boat sails as fast as the skipper will sail it. Some skippers are a lot more adept at exploiting vessel idiosincracies than others. Others are more adept at keeping the sail too tight in the belief that heel increases speed. They are just too darn lazy to release the sheets and let the vessel ride faster upright or they are afraid of letting the boat sail upright. The max angle of heel on any sailboat is 15 degrees, any more than that and the rudder starts acting like a brake and losing power which in turn causes the boat to round up onto the wind.

I sailed an x with a 75hp hanging in a race against an M and the X won handily once the skipper let the flat bottom sailboat ride at minimum angle of heel.

What is this thing of sailing with the mast shrouds in the water? It is so exciting that you would rather sail slower than let it sail upright and fast?

A Catamaran is faster but not in all points of sail.

Some of that criticism of the X might be traditionalists fighting change or they just plain don't like the X. Or they like putting down people that don't agree with them.

Québec 1 · Post by **Québec 1** » Sat Apr 30, 2011 9:26 am

My M 's top sailing speed is 10.9 knots, but it has a blue hull and no henweighs.
Q1

Trouts Dream · Post by **Trouts Dream** » Sat Apr 30, 2011 9:35 am

In Quebec its pronounced "N way"

Post by **dlandersson** » Sat Apr 30, 2011 10:00 am

1. Drugs.

2. Alcohol.

3. ????

Dangerdog wrote:Any particular reason? I tried searching this issue, couldnt find anything solid. Seems to me i can find X's (on average) at a lower price than the M.

Just curious what the differences are.

If there is a thread on this kindly point me to it.

thanks for any help, Jake

Dangerdog · Post by **Dangerdog** » Sat Apr 30, 2011 11:50 am

thanks guys

mastreb · Post by **mastreb** » Sat Apr 30, 2011 12:57 pm

Dangerdog wrote:Any particular reason? I tried searching this issue, couldnt find anything solid. Seems to me i can find X's (on average) at a lower price than the M.

Just curious what the differences are.

If there is a thread on this kindly point me to it.

thanks for any help, Jake

While I've not sailed an

my guess would be that it's just as fast but not as easy to get that speed. The hull speeds for the two boats are the same. Given enough wind, both will sail at their hull speeds and the X is more likely to get up on a plane than the M, which would be a technical advantage, but you've got to be a hull of a sailor to keep these boats on a plane. The M is almost certainly easier to sail and will probably make 1 more knot out of light air than the X due to the deeper V and the rotating mast.

Neither of them are anywhere near as fast nor as easy to sail as a traditional keel-boat. But I don't have the money to keep a boat slipped here in San Diego, so that's not an option for me.

As for price, these boats generally sell for 100% of the hull MSRP at the time they were first sold. So X's which are older are less expensive.

pokerrick1 · Post by **pokerrick1** » Sat Apr 30, 2011 1:05 pm

Dangerdog wrote:thanks guys

Sorry, this thread can't go away yet - - - you restarted something

Rick

pokerrick1 · Post by **pokerrick1** » Sat Apr 30, 2011 1:10 pm

Québec 1 wrote:My M 's top sailing speed is 10.9 knots, but it has a blue hull and no henweighs.
Q1

Then my top sailing speed is 10.91 knots because it has the faster white hull and no henweighs - - - which reminds me - - - some of the younger (newer) posters on this forum might not know how much henweighs slow you down

Rick

K9Kampers · Post by **K9Kampers** » Sat Apr 30, 2011 2:57 pm

... but it has a blue hull and no henweighs.

What's a ... blue hull??

Québec 1 · Post by **Québec 1** » Sat Apr 30, 2011 3:08 pm

K9Kampers wrote:
... but it has a blue hull and no henweighs.
What's a ... blue hull??

A blue hull is what's in front of a white hull

Q1

Ixneigh · Post by **Ixneigh** » Sat Apr 30, 2011 3:16 pm

I have no idea what a hen weight is. Something to keep your chickens from running away I guess.
I've had my boat out now in a variety of conditions and the only way I think I'd see ten k would be with a spinaker on a really windy day. In this condition nearly anything that floats will do that.
On a beam reach my instincts say around six tops maaaaybe seven but only if your paying attention. This boat requires attention to sail well. I have personally seen five and a half. She's got marginal canvas and little ability to stand up to enough wind to allow her to power through lumpy conditions. Good sail trim is mandatory. My 33ft would suffer lazy sailors and still sail fast. No so the M.
The amount of board down has a big effect as well.
My advice to beginners would be to not tighten everything in so much. Flat tight sails are only good in windy conditions and calm waters while trying to point as high as you can. Sail them a bit looser. The curvature of the sail provides drive.
The M is a challenging boat to sail. ironic since it's marketed towards beginners. There are lots of different things to adjust and play with. These make up for the modest speed in my opinion.

Ixneigh.

MacGregorSailors.com

MacGregorSailors.com

Why do some say the M sails better than the X?

Why do some say the M sails better than the X?

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