The Bomb exploded on my Motor (a bit long)

[Dimitri-2000X-Tampa]

I totally sympathize with Leon's problems here but frankly, I think that is not really a bad letter you got from them and that they took the time to respond like that. Its interesting that they brought up the fact of a collision last year. Did that coincide with the problems starting? After reading this thread, seems like the best course of action is swapping out the computer. Afterall, if you drop your laptop on the floor, it usually breaks something.

[delevi]

Victor, Thank you for taking the time to write a letter. You really shouldn't have gone through the trouble. But the response, for all to see; no warranty, no service. For the record, the collission they refer to involved replacing a rubber (internal) motor mount which was torn. I have no idea what swivel they're talking about. Either way, I can't imagine the two issues being related. As for not following operating procedure... what kind of load of crap is that? The problem started after I was out of warranty. I never asked BRP to cover the cost of the repair. I just wanted them to give better guidance to the mechanic to get it resolved. The result of the advice they gave to my mechanic boiled down to a huge bill, replacing numerous parts which most likely didn't need replacing. I bet that if it was a warranty issue and it was on BRP's dime, most of these parts wouldn't be replaced and the real source of the problem would be discovered. I simply wanted some support, not a freebie. When I take my out-of-warranty BMW in for repairs, they have mechanics who can actually figure out what is wrong and fix the real problem, not shoot in the dark, replacing parts, hoping it solves the problem. Perhaps my expectations are too high. Then again, BRP sure claims their Etec is the BMW/Mercedes of outboards. Is it the mechanic's fault? I don't know. I would expect that if the manufacturer has a list of mechanics who are "Authorized service providers for their brand," they should be able to properly diagnose and fix their product. Mind-boggling notion that this is happening because the mechanic can't afford the training. As for the computer, it's a $1000 + part. I'm not going to roll the dice on that. Plus, the mechanic and the BRP consultant both concur that there is absolutely no evidence that it's a computer problem.

Now to be completely fair, I must post the latest development. I had the boat out 3 times after I took it back. The problem seems to have improved significantly. I still get the missfire but it is now intermitten vs. constant at that RPM range. Sometimes no miss. The range also got smaller. How is it fixing itself? I have no idea. Perhaps the parts that were replaced should have fixed the problem but the computer took some time to adjust. Just a wild guess. Maybe the magic computer will keep improving things until the problem goes away. Or it could go the other way. Frankly, 2 of the 3 outings involved motoring just out of the marina until I put up sails. On one outing, I ran it for 45 minutes at 5000 RPM. I have tried to avoid the problem RPM range except for just a few times to see what happens.
At this point, I won’t be pursuing the issue unless the problem degrades. Life is too short. I want to enjoy the boat, not be in and out of the shop. If anything changes (good or bad) I’ll be sure to post.
Fair winds,
Leon

[Kelly Hanson East]

Leon - did you see my post on the 4 year emission warranty? From the letter that Vik posted, it looks like you might fall into that window on emission stuff.....understand and respect your 'life is short' mentality though...

when I had two kids hooked up to ventilators, I swore to myself that any problem that can be fixed by writing a check was not a real problem....

[1st Sail]

Leon,
Leon,

I got it right from the start. This is not a warranty issue it is a repair and diagnositics problem. You never pretened it was anything but.

I'm curious to know what specific rpm range(s) your engine misfires at in the future. As previously stated mine is between 3-4k which is the ideal cruising speed for the M26, below hull speed to slightly above hull speed. For long distance travel this is a real PIA. I think my dealer's response "it is what it is" is spot on. It seems these engines either run very well or less then 100% In the case of the less than 100% there does not seem to be a pragmatic diagnostic avaliable to the average technician. I seriously question the error feedback loop in the onboard computer when hooked up to the service computer.
It is obviously deficient therefore you just start replacing parts at the owners expense post warranty.

I'm curious, how may 4 stroker's out there have misfiring engines at specific rpm ranges like the Etec?

My engine was still under warranty when I purchased it from the PO. I noted the misfire to my dealer prior to the 3yr schedule service. Since I got the 'It is what it is" I put up with it. In retrospect I should have persued this further. I have an excellent dealer here and I think he was telling the truth. When they run well, great, if not settle for less than 100%.

Re: indexing plugs is hit or miss as the start of the thread positions is random during mfg. so you just keep putting in plugs until one lines up within the index range.

[waternwaves]

Leon,

I am glad it is working somewhat better.

But the bad news is.... it is most probably a loose or corroded connection/terminal or wire broken inside of its insulation

And if you think that the repair guys have a tough time finding failed parts...... you can pretty much forget them finding loose or intermittant wiring. However, it is well within most mac owners purview. (albeit a very slow process)

Good luck, Sorry you had to endure maintenance issues like that......perhaps the loose/corroded connection is due to something they checked and or removed.

Darren,
(we used to love it when those jobs came in the door...... lots of hours chasing connections......lots and lots..all billable)

[delevi]

Stephen,
On my 6th year with the boat now, engine new w/boat-dealer installed, so the 4-year deal doesn't apply to me.

1st,
At its worst, it was missing between 1800-3000 RPM. Now, more like 2100-2500. Much better and much easier to avoid this range.

Darren,
Appreciate your insight as always.

fair winds all,
Leon

[Kelly Hanson East]

Sorry, I re-read and I am a dumba**

...pullin' for ya, nonetheless...

[Boblee]

Leon
Yeah It's like a dog chasing it's tail trying to find whats wrong with these things, when they are going, it's great but anything that upsets the delicate balance or that the computor can't compute because it doesn't fit and then it's a problem.
I think for our boats with such a huge variability we need something basic, it wouldn't be so bad if you knew what was wrong and you knew that it wasn't going to fail and leave you stranded or crippled in dangerous conditions but even the experts can't give that assurance or even find out what is causing the problems.
I was lucky? that I notified the dealer within hours of putting the boat on the water, I didn't know what the Etec was supposed to sound like but it didn't sound right especially at only certain revs but I wonder how many would just accept that "it is what it is" and in most cases that would be ok except that mine varied from an off sounding or flat note to a dead set kerplunk and struggling to attain revs.
Mine in particular could be more of a problem as the loads and speeds vary so much, very little remains the same from one trip to the next and reliability is critical these are definitely IMHO not the motor for my situation in particular or even Macs in general, I wish I had followed my gut and installed a Honda or Yamaha at the start.

[delevi]

OK, I have some bad news and some possible good news. Forget what I posted last about the problem improving. It's running poorly again. Now it missfires at 1000-1500 rpm when cold, and still 2000-3000 (warm or cold.)

Now the possible good news. I received a call from my Mac dealer that the BRP service rep will be in the area next month, and he is willing to test-run my boat to check out the problem. I'm certainly taking him up on this. We'll see where it goes.

Leon

[beene]

Ok
You see where this goes......
But based on what happened to you, I am not going to buy an ETEC anything, ever!

I am sold on the Suzuki 90 that Victor is currently testing.

I own 2 motorcycles, 2001 and 2009, both Suzuki, and both are outstanding in quality and performance.

Best bang for the buck on the market and never need anything but oil changes.

Best of luck to you Leon.

G

[1st Sail]

FWIW I discussed the misfire ignition issues with my good dealer again yesterday. He noted that the Optimax has the same issue. He commented that the Optimax has a cross over zone which misfires similar to the Etec. With respect to the larger engines with 3+ cylinders it is less noticeable.

In the case with Leon the issues is more than just a cross over problem.

[Highlander]

Leon

Sorry to hear of your woe's but all is not lost I've told Beene to bring his Rowing Arms with him
Keep us posted to bad you have to wait a month !!!! whats the guy riding a bike ! to get their

J

[BrazDaz]

Sounds like it might be time to pay for and do the factory training Myself there could be a good Buck in knowing how to fix these things $$$$$

[delevi]

Well.. I am very happy to report that the problem has been solved. The BRP rep fixed it yesterday. More details later.

Leon

[March]

Yipee and congrats! I was waiting with bated breath, It's about that time of the year and a pucker factor involving the ETEC is something I need as much as water in the blige. Can hardly wait for the details. Way to go, Leon!