Buying a new main sail ? Muslehead ?

[School House Steve]

March 30th. Trying to send picture of new sail via photobucket. When I follow HamminX's instructions I get stuck just after I click the IMG code box but I can't find where to select copy. Has photo bucket changed something?

[NiceAft]

[Hamin' X]

March 30th. Trying to send picture of new sail via photobucket. When I follow HamminX's instructions I get stuck just after I click the IMG code box but I can't find where to select copy. Has photo bucket changed something?

After you click on the IMG code, right click on the highlighted text and copy should appear on the pop-up menu. Alternate method and the one that I use: After highlighting the code, use the keyboard shortcut, Ctrl C. Use Ctrl V to paste.

~Rich

[c130king]

Could be the issue with photobucket is the "intermediate" step after you upload it and before you are in your album able to cut/paste the IMG code...

I get sent to a page with my picture asking if I want to add a description or caption...your picture is showing but you can't access the IMG code from this page...at least I think you can't.

Add your caption and hit the appropriate button (I think maybe it is "save" or "return to album" or something like that) or don't add a caption and then hit the button anyway. Then once back in your album you can put the curser over the picture and your IMG code (along with the other three codes which I can't remember at this time) will show up.

Just a thought. If that is not the problem then please disregard.

Cheers,
Jim

[bubba]

Along with new sails we are buying a 'lazy jack main sail bag' like non dingy sailboats have, for dropping there main sail in a bag and just zip it up to fully cover the main sail. I wonder with the Muscle head sail is the bag custom fit to not need to remove the top batten to fully zip the cover closed. Correct me if I am wrong but constiantly removing and replacing this batten will premiturely wear the batten pocket and cause a failure and the batten will pop off out in the water in a stiff breeze 15+ mph.

The other thing I learned about full battens jaming in the sail track when hoisting and dropping the main : A product called 'Strong Track ' sold by Tides Marine in Fla. it is a slick plastic type track that comes in a roll 40+ inches dia , it feeds into the mast rope track and has it's own sail slides and heavy duty batten slides. This product has slides that are made not to jam like the plastic slides always do for me now. Track and slides comes with all the slides, batten holder slides and stops needed for $780.00. I think for someone who sails more than 100 days a year like we do, raising and lowering the sails with ease is most important.

Is there Muclehead main sails owners who have a loose foot on the boom? Does the stock boom have enough length to tighten the outhall? Our in boom bolt rope really does not tighten the sail foot any longer, I think the main sail foot rope shrunk leaving the sail bottom with baggy pleats. I looked at one of the photos shown here and the Muscle head has the same rope and baggy sail foot. Talking to several sailmakers who know that echomical bolt ropes do shrink causing the sails to loose there up wind or flat sail shape very quickly. What causes shrinkage is one summers heat more than UV dammage to sail cloth, most echnomical bolt ropes will not streach back to there origional shape causing good sail material to look baggy untill new rope in installed HAHA not, there shot for getting good up wind sail shape.

[delevi]

The answer: Loose foot. You won't regret it. To take full advantage, you would be well served in investing in a powerful outhaul, ideally one you can control from the cockpit.

Full battens use special cars which attach to the slide. The batten exits the sail at the luff and plugs into the car so as not to tear through the sail. Full battens are harder to hoist. That's the nature of the beast. Not sure how the $800 system would help, but personally, I would save the money and spray silicone on the slugs every so often. I also installed a 2:1 halyard which helps a lot and eliminates the need to winch the halyard. Very handy for reefing when the winch is in use by the jib sheet.

Batten pockets come in various configurations. IMHO, mechanical is the best option. I am extremely happy with mine as there is no velcro involved. A fitting slips over the batten at the leech. A rope loop is stitched to the leech of the sail. This loop fits over the batten fitting. The fitting has a screw that is tightened, causing it to expand and push the batten towards the luff, thus causing the tension on the loop which holds the fitting and batten in place. The sytem is virtually bullet-proof. No lost battens, and you can control the tension... something you can't do with rubber bands and velcro.

Pay close attention to the batten hardware you get with the sail. You shouldn't need to get 3rd party accessories. Also, battens themselves are important, particularly on our swept spreaders and going downwind. The proper amount of flex will allow the top of the sail to twist perpendicular to the wind. This is something I couldn't do with the OEM sails. Can't be certain, however, whether this is due to the batten quality or the fact that they're full length vs. partial on the OEM sail.

At the end of the day, whatever you do, you will be delighted with the improvement over the stock sails.

Leon

[bubba]

Yes I know new sail will help lots that is why I am doing this reserch not to down grade any sails, matter of fact as for as the price I could buy a new musclehead main every year and come out ok with the price.

I was wondering with a loose foot does the bolt rope at the sail foot stay equally streached with the fabric or does it still shrink causeing wrinkles in the sail material anyway like photos shown here that use the rope in the boom method.

[delevi]

There is no bolt rope at the foot of a loose-footed sail.



Maybe a good comparison of roach size with mine next to Nice Aft's musclehead.

[Highlander]

My has a loose footed mainsail you would not believe the diff it makes standard on the

here's my oem main converted to a loose footed sail bolt rope removed what a diff.


As per Leon Loose footed main is the only way to go for better sail shape & control & yes you will want at least a 3-1 outhaul i'm working on a inboom set up right now

J

[bubba]

I figured we would need a more powerful outhall with 0% streach line to be able to control the foot properly. With the current boom length is there length enough to streach the sail foot taught enough for good up wind sailing and not have the boom slide to come out of the boom. Our current main sail has no space at the aft end of the sail foot the boom is too short to streach the bag out of the sails it so streached out of shape.

Since I have been getting bids on crusing sails most sail lofts have ask ' Do we want UP wind sails or DOWN wind 'Trade Wind' sails' and when I ask what the difference is, up wind sails are cut flatter and don't get baggy too soon to carve the wind like a wing and Trade Wind sails are fuller and do a great job sailing down wind, like around the world down the trade winds. Since I live and sail upwind 80% of the time it seams, were looking at a flat cut sail with not much streach and a better outhall.

[School House Steve]

Here's the picture I was trying to post last night for Bubba showing the Musclehead sail in the down position. Thanks to HaminX and my son for the computer help. This picture was taken two weeks ago after sunset, testing my new sail. And for those Mac sailors in Calif. with the warm weather and boat taxes, I have to admit while this weekend was sunny, the temp dipped to 33 degrees INSIDE the cabin Sunday morning! Still good sailing for the boat I named "Comfortably Numb".

[bubba]

Nice photo is that the pond in your back yard ? Is your main loose footed ?

[delevi]

With the current boom length is there length enough to streach the sail foot taught enough for good up wind sailing and not have the boom slide to come out of the boom. Our current main sail has no space at the aft end of the sail foot the boom is too short to streach the bag out of the sails it so streached out of shape.

No problem flattening mine. Not sure what happens with the sails made in bulk. If you have sails made, they will make the foot as long as needed. They will also ask how much roach you' want, etc, etc. Part of what you pay for when you shell out the big money to a big-name loft. The Quantum rep actually came out to my boat and took all measurements. The sails are made specifically for your boat and for your desired application. Fully custom.

Since I have been getting bids on crusing sails most sail lofts have ask ' Do we want UP wind sails or DOWN wind 'Trade Wind' sails' and when I ask what the difference is, up wind sails are cut flatter and don't get baggy too soon to carve the wind like a wing and Trade Wind sails are fuller and do a great job sailing down wind, like around the world down the trade winds. Since I live and sail upwind 80% of the time it seams, were looking at a flat cut sail with not much streach and a better outhall.

Such options were not offered to me. Perhaps because I requested sails with a flat cut which would be most efficient in heavy air. Of course, the same would be best for upwind work. I don't see why anyone would want a "downwind" baggy sail. The beauty of a loose-footed sail is you can still create ample draft for downwind work by slacking the outhaul (a lot.) You can go from flat as a blade to drafty as a headsail. Of course, you can also fly the chute

[Terry]

Along with new sails we are buying a 'lazy jack main sail bag' like non dingy sailboats have, for dropping there main sail in a bag and just zip it up to fully cover the main sail. I wonder with the Muscle head sail is the bag custom fit to not need to remove the top batten to fully zip the cover closed. Correct me if I am wrong but constiantly removing and replacing this batten will premiturely wear the batten pocket and cause a failure and the batten will pop off out in the water in a stiff breeze 15+ mph.

Constantly removing the top batten is completely un-necessary, I never remove any of my battens. Your best bet is to just buy a small D-shackle that is small enough to fit through the same hole that the existing slug shackle fits and replace it, then all you do is disconnect the top sail slug whenever you wish to put your sail cover on, works for me.

Here's the picture I was trying to post last night for Bubba showing the Musclehead sail in the down position.

You can see in Steve's pic here that there is only a small portion of the sail headboard remaining up, all you need is a a quick removal D-shackle in the top position and it will allow you to drop that headboard down easily and put a sail cover over it. When you do buy the shackle (a tiny one) buy two or three because it is quite trying getting that little D-shackle fiddled into place and the chances of dropping it or the little pin down the daggerboard trunk is very probable and although I have not done so yet, I am sure I will eventually.

[bubba]

I agree with you

Such options were not offered to me. Perhaps because I requested sails with a flat cut which would be most efficient in heavy air. Of course, the same would be best for upwind work. I don't see why anyone would want a "downwind" baggy sail. The beauty of a loose-footed sail is you can still create ample draft for down wind sailing. You can go from flat as a blade to drafty as a headsail. Of course, you can also fly the chute

Yes we have a 350 sq ft a- spinnaker w/ chute scoop for down wind sailing who wouldn,t that likes to really sail. I guess my days of buying Non Designated Up Wind flat designed sails off the shelf are over since my education from sailmakers on sails lately. Maybe I could buy Non Designated off the shelf sails and imediately have them redesigned to make up wind sails if that is at all possiable. We will be buying either North Sails or Quantium sails because they offer crusing sails shaped for up wind sailing since there experence of desiging raceing sails with little or no streach in there materials and there more or less local in Seattle and they will check our sails yearly for possiable repairs and wear. Quantium sails does not charge state sales tax and there is lots of money saved at 9% and they help put there new sails on our boat and go for a test sail at no extra charge. We did buy our MacGregor to sail, not motor in to the breeze and not over heal our boat due to full down wind cut sails, I just turned 60 years old on March 1 and I want great sails for our Mac M to start my partial retirement on, so we are not tempted to buy a bigger boat because of baggy sail performance.
It would be nice if Kelly Hansen Sails offered an up wind flat cut sail made with a radial design and cross cut dacron or laminate sail material but they don't offer 2 sail designs or have a sail maker to talk to and no loft in my state for yearly maintance and repairs As far as Port Townsend sails I learned a lot reading there web site articals but final bid of $9405.00 (including 9% sales tax) is $3378.00 over the next expensive sail lofts is too mutch even if there USA made by American hands and materials. The UK Halsey Sails would compete with the best but they only have a sales office in WA and there sails loft is in B.C. Canada and talking to there sail designer has been difficult at best.