12V Cooler

[FLembo18]

Hello Mates,

Summer of 2009 was my 1st sailing season with my new Mac, which I really enjoyed. I'd go out to a local area lake (small) and anchor in some nice quiet cove for a long relaxing weekend aboard my beautiful Mac. (Blue)
http://www.compactappliance.com/P85-Koo ... el_Coolers
The only thing that I didn't like was running out of Ice to cool my beer, wine & food. (Exactly in that order) . So i'm now looking at this cooler by Koolatron (52 Qt. capacity). My concern is the amp. consumption while it's running overnight. During the day I use my Stereo system alot, really enjoy that ! I have a dual battery setup W/ three way switch. I also run the engine while at anchor to help charge the batteries, usually for 20 minutes every 3 hr's . At night I get up and run the engine for about 20 minutes.. currently the anchor light is the only draw of amps. while I sleep. Do any of you think that I'll have any problems by adding this cooler & it running overnight ?

Please Advise.

Thanks,

Frank L.

[nedmiller]

Hi Frank,
There are a lot of threads on this topic and lots of opinions, so you should do a search and settle in for some reading. You should look up the output of your Honda at idle vs its usage. It may not give you much benefit as far as charging since your Honda may consume much of the electricity it produces. I did a lot of research before I bought and decided the Koolatron would not be adequate when we were in really hot weather since it doesn't drop the temperature enough. Since we take long trips in addition to the weekend trips, we needed something very efficient and with the much more expensive Engel 45. IMHO, for just weekends stick with a high quality ice cooler. You can freeze jugs of ice at home, and your beer will be colder on a really hot day.
If you decide to take long cruises, you will use a lot of amps to run a cooler and will either have to motor a lot or pick up a solar panel--or get a generator to charge your batteries.

SILK

[Sumner]

Personally I would save your money. I bought a similar one and put it in.....................



http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner ... index.html

.......my teardrop years ago. I only used it on the the 12 volts a few times. It would suck my 12 volt RV battery in the teardrop down to nothing in about 6-8 hours. At that point you are going to need a good charging system to get it back up like has been mentioned. I converted it to using ice, but it isn't really an efficient cooler with ice either, but at this point I had to make do since nothing else would fit in that space.

As you mentioned they will only lower the temp about 20-30 deg max, so if it is 90 out you have 60 deg. to 70 deg. food and beer. I didn't trust it with the food part and the beverages were warm.

I think a cooler like this has it's place in you vehicle on a trip where you are running down the road with the air conditioning on and it is 70 in the vehicle and the cooler is getting amps off of the alternator on the running motor.

Read this thread from the other day.............

http://www.macgregor26x.com/forum/viewt ... =9&t=15020

............as there is a lot to garner from it. I agree with the previous post if your trips are 5 days or less get a good 5 day cooler. If they are longer either go in and replenish the ice or get a frig with a 'real' compressor on it, that is what we are going to do.

c ya,

Sum

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[Highlander]

I have a Koolatron caddy model # P34 I used it when travelling long distances camping I now use it on the boat for wk-ends it has two settings refrigerate takes the inside temp down to 42deg F. below the outside surrounding temp. or max cold takes it down to 50deg F. below out side surounding temp. its great when slipped at the dock with hydro on max cold during the daytime when docked it will run constant, at night when on refrigerate it will recylce on and off as necc, with dual batt charger & hydro it is not a problem when slipped. I keep a tray inside it to hold my bag of ice cubes for my refreshments ! while sailing I turn it off & the ice cubes keep it cold inside water melted from the ice cubes is used for cooking & dishes when cruising or power sailing it can be left on refrigerate or max cold I also have a 5day cooler for storing frozen food & frozen water jugs, stuff thats being used on a daily basis goes in the koolatran
its also used for house party's as a beer cooler it will keep food or beer very cold in max poss. I've had it for over 25yrs with no trouble it does though eat up batt. power a 55amp/hr batt will run the unit for approx 6-11hrs a 90amp/hr heavy duty batt will run the unit for 20-36hrs so with a bigger battery its not to bad, the units battery warning light will flash on /off when your battery drops to about 11 volts telling you that the battery requires recharging, the unit shuts itself off when the batt, dropps to 6volts as I also have a 1000 inverter gen. recharging while on the hook is not a problem or at anytime as long as I have the gen with me
So hope this helps all depends what you intend on using the unit for up here where I live it does a good job but if I lived in a hot climate all yr I'd go for the more effecient costlier unit it would most likely pay off in the end especaily if you plan on doing the BA trip and staying their for 3 months or more

J

[Erik Hardtle]

Get an Engle 35... it works great and won't drain your battery.

Do a search on this site for Engle refrigerator and check out the mods on my website.

[Russ]

The only thing that I didn't like was running out of Ice to cool my beer, wine & food. (Exactly in that order)

If you like your beer cold, don't get a Thermo Electric cooler like that one. They are inexpensive for a reason.
1) They will make your beer cool, not cold. Same for everything else in it.
2) They will suck your battery down very fast.

I'm looking for a cooler solution. See this thread.


I think I'm going with the Waeco cooler.

--Russ

[FLembo18]

Thanks to everyone for your replies, I will review all of the great info that you guys posted.

Happy New Year !

Frank L.

[KayakDan]

I just bought an Edgestar FP 430 43 quart fridge/freezer for $398.70,and shipping was free. Killer deal!
http://www.compactappliance.com/FP430-C ... lt,pd.html
If your in the market for a fridge,this might be it.
I was really set on buying the Engel 45,but the $300 difference just tipped me over.

[opie]

Congrats!!

Right now I use a cooler and block ice that I make with home-frozen 2 liter bottles, lasts me 3-4 days....

But, the freezer is on my wish list, but I am wavering over the decision.....

What did you think of the energy usage for each one that you considered?

Energy requirements:
Edgestar -- DC 12/24 Volts, 4.5 Amps/2.5 Amps
Engel 45 -- 0.7 - 2.5 Amps (refrig vs freezer)

Comparing both as freezers to make ice....

So the Edgestar uses more juice than the Engel. Using my dual Group 24 deep cycle batteries @ 75AH each, not letting them go below 12.2 volts (50%), would give me 33 hours total use of the Edgestar (assuming 50% duty cycle of freezer) and 60 hours for the Engel 45.

(75ah x 2)x(50%)/(4.5 x 50%)=33, and (75x2x.5)/(2.5 x 50%)=60.

So after 1 1/2 days with the Edgestar I would need to run my 10amp Honda50 for about 18 hours to make up the 75ah (18 hrs b/c you need more AH "in" than you used "out" , assuming 100 AH needed to recharge, and assuming 5.5 amps available for batteries because: 10 amps available less 2.5 amps (Edgestar at 50% duty) and less 2 amps for the boat. Therefore, 100/5.5=18.

The Engel would last 2 1/2 days before charging the batteries was required.

I could not find out data that says the Edgestar has a lower power use for refrigeration setting.

On edit--- I reduced the amps available since the freezer still had to be running during recharging, I assumed.

[Bobby T.-26X #4767]

i've got an Engel 35 and wouldn't trade it for anything.
it fits neatly under the rear settee of my X.
when not in the X, it's in the rear of my SUV.
wife loves it when shopping for groceries in the warm Southern California climate.







Bob T.
"DāBob"
'02X w/ '04 90-TLDI (14" x 11 pitch)
Dinghy Motor: '06 2.5-Suzuki

[nedmiller]

We went with the Engel 45 because the space under the aft dinette seat had already been modified. That meant we could go with a bit bigger Engel--the electrical usage isn't that different. We have a 65 watt solar panel that helps out a lot and a Honda 1000e to charge up things pretty quickly if the power usage exceeds the solar panel. The problem with the solar panel is that we have it mounted on the sliding hatch and it gets shaded often if we are sailing. The Engel is amazingly efficient. On shorter trips we use it as a refrigerator...same as we used to use the cooler except we don't buy ice. On longer trips, we switch over to freezer and keep frozen meat, juice, even ice cream there...and also use it to freeze ice for the cooler. We haven't taken a trip in tropical weather so don't know how much strain will be put on the batteries when we do. It may be that we have to move the solar panel back to the arch. WAIT... We don't have an arch! Another Mod!
The little Honda 1000e is easy to carry and store and can be used for a bunch of other things too!
SILK

[opie]

BobbyT,
I have seen your great looking freezer mod before but wondered about recharging the batteries while using the freezer. Ned's explanation as to how he recharges with a generator makes sense. I just don't think you can have a freezer and expect the outboard motor built-in charger to really do anything for you. Solar panels seem of marginal use as well, as Ned reports. Bobby, do you use a generator also? Do either of you recommend a boat freezer without a generator? In a car, you effectively have a generator, as the 30 to 40 amp alternator is running all the time the car is running.

[Sumner]

...........So after 1 1/2 days with the Edgestar I would need to run my 10amp Honda50 for about 18 hours to make up the 75ah (18 hrs b/c you need more AH "in" than you used "out" , assuming 100 AH needed to recharge, and assuming 5.5 amps available for batteries because: 10 amps available less 2.5 amps (Edgestar at 50% duty) and less 2 amps for the boat. Therefore, 100/5.5=18.............

It is really hard to make some of these comparisons. The Engle uses less amps "when running" than say a Waeco does, so it is easy to say it uses less electricity, but from some reports.......

http://home.iprimus.com.au/rfh/portablefridges.html

http://home.iprimus.com.au/rfh/portablefridges2.html

.....the Waeco is actually more efficient and cycles less, so uses less overall electricity which is the most important aspect, not the instantaneous amperage. After the post about the edgestar I called them and researched them yesterday and I can't come up with a conclusion about their overall usage. They seem to use yet another compressor than the Waeco and the Engle is different also. They do seem to look to have maybe thicker insulation, which might mean they cycle on less, but who knows for sure.

It sure would be great to see a side by side comparison of the different ones over a 3-4 day period using models that are close to the same capacity storage wise.

We are going to most likely get the Waeco 50 and did just buy a second solar panel, an 80 watt that should provide most of the power for it.

As you noted the outboard and a 110 generator or poor choices to provide backup power. We have that covered....



....with the alternator generator I made......

http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner ... de-13.html

Actually I think the power needs of any of these are going to be close enough that maybe the deciding factor is how large of one you need and where will it go.

c ya,

Sum

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[KayakDan]

According to what I read,the Edgestar only lost 5oF when it was shut down for 8 hours overnight,so it's pretty efficient. Also doesn't cycle on more than about 10-15 min /hr at 60oF (according to the reviewer).
I'm not too worried about the power use between the two,as I will have two group 27 batteries ,and 2-65W solar panels,which should be plenty. Also considering carrying an 800w generator as backup. Running the Honda 50 just doesnt seem all that efficient for recharging on the hook.
Also planning on building a styrofoam box to contain the unit for extra insulation in the Bahamas.

[Bobby T.-26X #4767]

BobbyT,
I have seen your great looking freezer mod before but wondered about recharging the batteries while using the freezer. Ned's explanation as to how he recharges with a generator makes sense. I just don't think you can have a freezer and expect the outboard motor built-in charger to really do anything for you. Solar panels seem of marginal use as well, as Ned reports. Bobby, do you use a generator also? Do either of you recommend a boat freezer without a generator? In a car, you effectively have a generator, as the 30 to 40 amp alternator is running all the time the car is running.

i don't use a generator...it's over-kill for my Mac use.
for the 2-3 day trips that we take, lack of sufficient DC battery power has never been a problem. although I use the Engel unit as a refrigerator and keep the temp at 32-34 degrees. that way it cycles on-off less frequent.
i run a large deep cycle marine for my house battery that is charged via a combiner w/ the starter battery.
when at the docks I have a built-in, on-board charger that plugs into dock power, so the Engel is always running in DC mode.

i know that several on this board run dual 6 volt batteries for their house battery power and have extended range DC power for long weekend trips.

Bob T.
"DāBob"
'02X w/ '04 90-TLDI (14" x 11 pitch)
Dinghy Motor: '06 2.5-Suzuki