Jackline Placement

hartflat · Post by **hartflat** » Tue Jan 29, 2008 4:11 pm

Well, according to what's out there, cold water robs the body's heat 32 times faster than cold air. SF Bay, (being replete with polutants & particulate matter) may be a tad bit warmer than coastal waters in our area. Even though, any body of water in the northern hemisphere north of Route 66 in the US, or the Mediterranean in the EU would not be a good thing to fall into during anythime of the year.

at 70–80° F (21–27° C) exhaustion or unconsciousness occurs in 3–12 hours & the expected survival tme is 3 hours to an indefinate period of time.

at 60–70° F (16–21° C) exhaustion or unconsciousness occurs in 2–7 hours & the expected survival time is 2–40 hours.

at 50–60° F (10–16° C) exhaustion or unconsciousness occurs in 1–2 hours & the expected survival time is 1–6 hours.

at 40–50° F (4–10° C) exhaustion or unconsciousness occurs in 30–60 minutes & the expected survival time is 1–3 hours.

at 32.5–40° F (0–4° C) exhaustion or unconsciousness occurs in 15–30 minutes & the expected survival time is 30–90 minutes.

<32° F (<0° C) exhaustion or unconsciousness occurs in under 15 minutes & the expected survival time is under 15–45 minutes.

Methinks I should take my 6' tether back to WM & not venture out from the cockpit, unless I'm on all fours tied to a very short leash:? .

Moe · Post by **Moe** » Tue Jan 29, 2008 5:39 pm

Think about putting a stainless steel bow eye in the center of the cockpit sole just forward of the steering pedestal to attach your tether to.

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It would have to be forward enough to allow you to reach the winches, etc while wrapped around one side of you, yet aft enough for you to operate the helm, as well as tend the rudder hold down lines if necessary. This assumes lines led to the cockpit, of course.

The diagonal upward run of the 6' tether also may keep you from going over the side.

The problem I see with a jackline on a narrow boat is that it deflects and stretches too much. I'd rather clip on to a hard point.

Divecoz · Post by **Divecoz** » Tue Jan 29, 2008 5:50 pm

Moe wrote: I'd rather clip on to a hard point.

Me too ! Lead All those line aft!

Highlander · Post by **Highlander** » Tue Jan 29, 2008 6:20 pm

Well I can remember about three yrs ago about 12miles out in Georgian bay early June hike out on the side 20Knt winds big gust comes up boat goes over 65-75deg heel i release the sheets too much boat comes back up so fast tosses me o/b all I had for a tether was a 50ft rope attached to me with a pfd attached to the other end which was attached to the stern rails , with the sails now flaping in the wind the boat comes to a stop by that time the pfd has slid down the line to me the wind starts pushing the along at at least 1 -1 1/2 knts water was very cold that time of yr as it was a very cold spring that yr in the water about 1 min now so cold can not put on the pfd properly so slip my arms into sleeve holes from the front pull my self back to the boat legs are now cramping up, pull the ladder down took me forever to get back on board was not a pretty site thought I was pulling 700# back onto the boat , I now have a survival suite a safety harness & tether

so without a survival suite its going to be pretty ugly with the survival suite your hole body has floation & will retain your body heat longer the leg cramps from the cold are your worst enemy really hard to pull your self back on board with just your arms !!

hartflat · Post by **hartflat** » Tue Jan 29, 2008 7:31 pm

Great idea Moe!

...maybe a bow eye in the center of the cockpit, close enough to the companionway so as to not be in the way, yet offer enough room to reach the base of the mainsail mast.

ronacarme · Post by **ronacarme** » Tue Jan 29, 2008 9:07 pm

1. Excellent idea to add a center cockpit deck eye as strong point to clip harness while working in cockpit.
2. Also a good attachment point for aft end of jackline led on center line of boat fwd over main hatch slider past mast to one or both bow cleats. One downside is tensioned jackline interferes with closing mainhatch slider or is loose with mainhatch slider open.....both bad in rough weather.
Solution? Insert washboards to keep spray out of cabin, close mainhatch slider, use stock hasp to hold mainhatch slider closed, and tension jackline over the top of the mainhatch slider. But how do we avoid locking crew in cabin with the hasp? Instead of using stock hasp, add some sort of latch openable from both in cabin and in cockpit?
A crude latch might be a rigid U- shape comprising (a) a bight formed by a rod or machine screw extending rotatably thru a horizontal hole in the depending aft lip of the mainhatch slider and (b) opposed, parallel, fore and aft legs fixed to the ends of the bight..... the legs being downwardly pivotable to respectively overlap the cabin and cockpit faces of the top washboard and so block forward opening of the mainhatch slider, the legs being pivotable above the washboards to allow the mainhatch slider to slide fwd to its open position.
Any better thots as to anchoring the aft jackline end?
Ron

Zoran · Post by **Zoran** » Tue Jan 29, 2008 11:22 pm

I used to tie myself to the pedestal with a spare rope, than I purchased a inflatable pfd with harness and now I tie my pfd to the pedestal with the spare rope. Reason, I am still looking to a solution. In my personal opinion jack line will not work on our boats (especially mine as I have dodger and side "wings" that wrap around front cockpit stanchions). What I think will work is to have deck eyes in the cockpit, base of the mast and by the anchor locker. have double short tether and when moving on boat do not detach one until the other one is secured. In order to be able to do this you can temporary secure the second tether to stanchions. IMHO a fall overboard will rarely happen when you are prepared and moving on the deck so temporary tie will be fine, it is when you are working on tangled line, anchor or something else that you can expect surprise. That is when I would like to be tied to a solid point with short tether that will not allow me to reach the water but rather stay above in the cockpit or on the deck. Setup like this will be PITA to use and implement but that is the price to pay to be safe.

Zoran

bastonjock · Post by **bastonjock** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 4:18 am

having experienced being in the water at 2knots trying to hang onto an oilrig has me agreeing with chip,you will have a very difficult to nearly impossible time trying to pull yourself aboard, for me a short tether is the answer

SURV69 · Post by **SURV69** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 6:14 am

I always thought a jack-line was supposed to keep one "on", the boat . . . not just "attached", to a boat. I'd rather like the idea of not being able to fall over the lifelines.

Acually, wasn't dragging a seaman a form of punishment for breaking rules?

IN any case, there's no way, I'd want to be attached to a boat steaming ahead at 4+knots and trying to get back on.

I would suggest that if a jackline is used to keep a person "attached" to a boat, that a second line astern might be added to realease the main & headsail, or at least be able to pull the rudder hard to port or starboard

bastonjock · Post by **bastonjock** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 7:33 am

there is one guy who is developing an auto pilot and i think that one of the actions of it will be to put the boat into a circle if you fall overboard

delevi · Post by **delevi** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 10:39 am

Great idea Moe. I'm actually considering clipping to the stanchion base while in the cockpit and to the vang attachment at themast while on deck. I replaced mine with a larger U-bolt so a shackle will fit. A solid connectin just makes sense.

Leon

Moe · Post by **Moe** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 4:16 pm

Leon, the problem with a stanchion base is it won't keep you in/on the boat. You could be dangling over/in the water with a pretty high (likely impossible) climb, especially to the cabin top stanchions. I like the idea of a hard point at the mast base, especially if used with a short tether. Getting from the cockpit to the mast while tethered can be tricky though. A jackline from the cockpit sole not too tight over the companionway hatch, to the mast base (as mentioned above), with a short tether could work.

Night Sailor · Post by **Night Sailor** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 6:39 pm

I was on the foredeck in my driveway today making measurements for noseeum nettng for the front hatch when I realized that no one has mentioned how much safer it would be on the bow even when sitting down, if the lifelines on the X went forward to the top of the pulpit from the cabin stanchions.
True you would have to recut the jib and jenny but the lower portion near the deck below that height is probably not very significant for cruising performance anyway, at least for cruisers. A high foot foresail would greatly improve forward visibilty from the helm also, another safety consideration.

delevi · Post by **delevi** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 10:03 pm

I don't think you would need to recut the headsail. The M has lifelines to the pulpit and the jib just pushes up against the whole deal.

Moe · Post by **Moe** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 3:58 am

I'm having to lower the lifelines forward on our C-18 to be more like the X location because I had our new 135 genoa built as a decksweeper, a little taller than the stock one. Before lowering, it laid over the lifeline and didn't get good shape at the foot.

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Jackline Placement

Moe

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